more mini notches

[pantheraba]

I think Riggs is the resident a@@hold at the Buzz, best as I remember.

Willie IS a punk...I have met him and KNOW it to be true. A lovable punk but still a punk...OUR punk, though.

 

[MasterBlaster]

I love his rosy, cherub face!

 

[murphy4trees]

I apprecite the support Gary.. and there was no bypass dutchman on that notch.. I went back and looked too, and there was something reflecting light there, that might look like a dutchman, but it was not. A bypass cut looks like a dark line, not light on most video. You can go back and look at the notch from the original camera angle earlier, and clearly see it is a clean notch.

Originally Posted by Skwerl
Well then go somewhere with a bunch of inexperienced idiots so you can be their hero. Your crap has grown old around here. We aren't here for you to 'teach' us, nobody here is interested in your preachings. This is where we come to relax, not be preached at by some fool. You don't know enough to preach here.[/QUOTE]



I am with Murphy on this one...some of the guys on this forum DO know a whole lot more than I do or ever will. I appreciate the time Dan takes to put out these videos. Reading the comments of the pros about his videos is instructional in itself...Willie (SOTC) commented that he noticed a dutchman at 1:29...I went back and, sure enough, there it was. He saw something I did not and took the time to point it out. That in itself was instructional for me. Without Dan's video there would have not been any exchange of info.

People post videos for different reasons...and putting it out for others to see is inviting comment...some tactful, some helpful, some rude. But, just like the vids are posted for different reasons, folks can get different things from them. Some of the techniques are interesting to see done, some are new (to some of us with limited experience) and some may be dangerous. That is where I like to see where the pro fallers, loggers, arborists weigh in and give their input.[/QUOTE]

 

[squisher]

No offense Gary but I wouldn't be taking anything from that vid. Unless your plan is to make a simple operation overly complex.

 

[canadiantreeman]

These are excellent points... they show the difference between the logger, falling trees in the woods for a living and the arborist, falling trees in suburban setting.. These are different animals with far different needs and concerns. Its a BIG MISTAKE to judge one by the other's standards.. Or more importantly to blindly apply the techniques used by loggers to suburban tree work...

Thats one of the biggest reason I prefer this site over the others. The skilled fallers are aplenty here. I have learned more about falling trees in the year I've been really active on this site and bringing the knowledge to work than the 4 I spent learning to be an arborist. I feel confident in my abilities as a sawyer, but not to the point of comparing myself to Michael Jordan. To say that the techniques used by fallers can't be applied to tree work is just plain silly. The techniques used by these loggers and logarborists here who are kind enough to share and document their work have helped me to become a more confident and proficient cutter. I can't imagine the knowledge I could gain by working with one of those folks for a couple of days or weeks.

Murph....grow up.

 

[Blinky]

and there was no bypass dutchman on that notch.

Gosh Willie you idiot, Daniel doesn't make mistakes...

 

[pete mctree]

Gosh Willie you idiot, Daniel doesn't make mistakes...

He's the real Mary Poppins don't you know - practically perfect in every way

 

[SkwerI]

I am with Murphy on this one...some of the guys on this forum DO know a whole lot more than I do or ever will. I appreciate the time Dan takes to put out these videos. Reading the comments of the pros about his videos is instructional in itself...Willie (SOTC) commented that he noticed a dutchman at 1:29...I went back and, sure enough, there it was. He saw something I did not and took the time to point it out. That in itself was instructional for me. Without Dan's video there would have not been any exchange of info.

People post videos for different reasons...and putting it out for others to see is inviting comment...some tactful, some helpful, some rude. But, just like the vids are posted for different reasons, folks can get different things from them. Some of the techniques are interesting to see done, some are new (to some of us with limited experience) and some may be dangerous. That is where I like to see where the pro fallers, loggers, arborists weigh in and give their input.

I'm sorry you are so slow, Gary.
But if you are still learning from Daniel's pathetic videos after 5 years at the Treehouse and 15-20 years of practical experience doing treework then perhaps it would be best if you quit now instead of continuing in ignorance. If you are serious about not being able to spot a Dutchman until seeing this video today then WTF are you doing running a chainsaw? If you are seriously that impaired then there are no words to describe your incompetence.

Unless you were just using this as an excuse to criticize me and further the petty bickering which emanates from all of Murphy's threads. :what:

 

[murphy4trees]

I said "blindly apply"... of course they can be applied... but we should not try to emmulate loggers in every detail... if they drop 500 trees in a week and we drop 10, how much more important is it for a logger to save 30-60 seconds on a falling cut than it is for us. That 30-60 seconds costs us 5-10 minutes a week.. a small price to pay for the added confidence we need to make falling cuts which often have little or no margin for error and can entail devastating consequences should things go wrong. That same 30-60 seconds per fall costs the logger 250-500 minutes a week... that could be as much as 8 hours... He better get those falling cuts right the first time or it is costing him BIG MONEY

To say that the techniques used by fallers can't be applied to tree work is just plain silly. The techniques used by these loggers and logarborists here who are kind enough to share and document their work have helped me to become a more confident and proficient cutter. I can't imagine the knowledge I could gain by working with one of those folks for a couple of days or weeks.
.

 

[murphy4trees]

You've blown petty bickering into venemous hate... Gary is a good guy and never has a bad word word to say about anybody... and you treat him like that... You're just as nasty as you've ever been.. Apparently getting sober isn't enough... You've got a well of grief all bottled up inside and it comes out sideways as anger. That is the typical American Male syndrome.. I feel sorry for you Rocky..

I'm sorry you are so slow, Gary.
But if you are still learning from Daniel's pathetic videos after 5 years at the Treehouse and 15-20 years of practical experience doing treework then perhaps it would be best if you quit now instead of continuing in ignorance. If you are serious about not being able to spot a Dutchman until seeing this video today then WTF are you doing running a chainsaw? If you are seriously that impaired then there are no words to describe your incompetence.

Unless you were just using this as an excuse to criticize me and further the petty bickering which emanates from all of Murphy's threads. :what:

 

[murphy4trees]

And how many more think like Gary or are annonymously here trying to learn something, but would never have the balls that Gary showed to stand up and say something. But you won't hear it.. you have to have your good old boy's club here.. no outsiders welcome and you make sure of it..

 

[Al Smith]

And how many more think like Gary or are annonymously here trying to learn something, but would never have the balls that Gary showed to stand up and say something.

Oh believe me Murph I've got the seeds but I'd rather just be entertained ,thank you much .

 

[Blinky]

Outsiders are welcomed here every week. It's the dickheads that have a bad time.
I will agree with you however that what Brian said to Gary was uncalled for. Gary's a good man.. damn good. And I'll agree that there was no dutchman at 1:29 but a fiber of wood catching direct sunlight... but you're still pretty much of a dickhead and a hypocrite.

 

[Widow Shooter]

Outsiders are welcomed here every week. It's the dickheads that have a bad time.
I will agree with you however that what Brian said to Gary was uncalled for. Gary's a good man.. damn good. And I'll agree that there was no dutchman at 1:29 but a fiber of wood catching direct sunlight... but you're still pretty much of a dickhead and a hypocrite.

Yep, I agree, Gary is a soft spoken genuine nice guy who likes to share with everyone here.

personally, in my opinion, what Brian said was pretty rude and he should apologize, but that is not my call, only he can decide that.

unfortunately, the spoken or printed word is like an arrow, once loosed; you can't call it back

 

[murphy4trees]

I can live with that! (what blinky said)

 

[murphy4trees]

Many are quick to shoot arrows, but slow to ask for forgiveness... admitting you're wrong in a public forum takes balls. We'll see if Rocky has a pair.

I AM grateful for this thread. I did make a mistake to post this as a good example of the mini notch and I'll start gutting a lot more hinges when appropriate.. that learning means a lot to me.

And I just edited what little footage there is of the bucket/climbing/rigging work on these two tulips.. I'll have to psot them later.. gotta go.

 

[canadiantreeman]

I said "blindly apply"... of course they can be applied... but we should not try to emmulate loggers in every detail... if they drop 500 trees in a week and we drop 10, how much more important is it for a logger to save 30-60 seconds on a falling cut than it is for us. That 30-60 seconds costs us 5-10 minutes a week.. a small price to pay for the added confidence we need to make falling cuts which often have little or no margin for error and can entail devastating consequences should things go wrong. That same 30-60 seconds per fall costs the logger 250-500 minutes a week... that could be as much as 8 hours... He better get those falling cuts right the first time or it is costing him BIG MONEY

If you set out to do something, do it right. I don't buy your excuses at all.

 

[stig]

I said "blindly apply"... of course they can be applied... but we should not try to emmulate loggers in every detail... if they drop 500 trees in a week and we drop 10, how much more important is it for a logger to save 30-60 seconds on a falling cut than it is for us. That 30-60 seconds costs us 5-10 minutes a week.. a small price to pay for the added confidence we need to make falling cuts which often have little or no margin for error and can entail devastating consequences should things go wrong. That same 30-60 seconds per fall costs the logger 250-500 minutes a week... that could be as much as 8 hours... He better get those falling cuts right the first time or it is costing him BIG MONEY

That is a pretty good reason for why your beloved mini notch doesn't have a place in Backyards tree work IMO.
The gain in time isn't worth the loss of accuracy and the added effort of getting the tree to fall.

Where it has a use is in slashing smaller trees for chipping in the woods.
When we are cutting trails in younger stands, we'll typically be one person cutting and the other pushing the tree over, unless the trees are real small.
The pusher uses a 12 foot pole with a short spike on top to push with.
In that kind of cutting where we are typically paid by the meters of trail cut or the tonnage of chips, getting the trees on the ground fast is more important than accurate felling.
So I'll most often just make a vertical cut that just goes through the bark instead of a notch.

 

[Old Monkey]

The funny in this thread has turned to mean. Let's keep the Murphy bashing friendly. I liked Gary's post and I think Brian took it the wrong way. No need to get carried away with it.

 

[murphy4trees]

There is no added effort when the tree is ties to a skid steer.. and often pinpoint accuracy is not needed in bakcyards either.
And thank you for bringing in some reasonable dialogue...

 

[Thor's Hammer]

Where it has a use is in slashing smaller trees for chipping in the woods.
When we are cutting trails in younger stands, we'll typically be one person cutting and the other pushing the tree over, unless the trees are real small.
The pusher uses a 12 foot pole with a short spike on top to push with.
In that kind of cutting where we are typically paid by the meters of trail cut or the tonnage of chips, getting the trees on the ground fast is more important than accurate felling.
So I'll most often just make a vertical cut that just goes through the bark instead of a notch.

I've seen that practice in the woods in Aarhus, with the Silvatec chipper working away on precut trails.

Ive also seen very shallow notches used for the bottom of prized hardwoods, to save timber.

 

[MasterBlaster]

Brian needs to settle the F down. Why do you even open Daniel's threads, Brian? Just to get all worked up over something on the internets?

 

[woodworkingboy]

Things kind of tossed in a heap here... I can understand why Brian gets upset, and hopefully Gary can put it into a wider perspective and not be bothered by the heat of the moment.

Imo, it's disrespectful to people to attempt to teach something with poor examples based on very insular, unproven, or to the extreme; false premises....keep throwing it at them. I shoulda woulda is after the fact. I consider myself a reasonably sensitive person in terms of expression and creativity, been making things for a select clientele all my life and living off the proceeds, and one potentially very boring and tedious aspect of the creative process, is when people make something mainly inspired by their own self indulgence, and offer it up as having broad meaningfulness for others. The lifetime of usefulness for these things tends to be very short at best. Sure, there may be a few who may want to find a purposefulness for themselves in it, but on the grand scale of things, I consider it wasteful bs that unfairly conscripts most people's time. These videos being put up really smack of it, from where I sit.

The world just doesn't need much more in the way of convoluted ideas or selfish expression, it's time to get real. There are lots of really excellent examples to show what can be much more positively accomplished by more studied and practiced ways, along with being better conveyed with the refined and disciplined manner of teaching it. There are some other treehouse members doing just that.

For fear of being self indulgent myself, speech over....and as someone once wisely said, "Beware of false teachers".

 

[18 stoner]

Daniel, just out of curiosity, do you find it hard work defending your corner on so many different sites?

I know of at least 3 tree forums you frequent and post vids, all of which are attacked in the same manner, all be it some in stronger language than the others.

It leads me to think of three points,

1, is it not having some effect on you, ie do you not feel outnumbered, and perhaps its time to listen for a change?

2, how on earth do you manage to find time to do any tree work, as im sure all these posts (on different forums) from you must take up a massive amount of your life?

3, Is it all worth it?

I am being straight with you, so please answer in the same.

 

[canadiantreeman]

Well put, Jay.