How'd it go today?

Wise words skwerl. I guess there's no way to absolutely cover myself even with a contract and 1/3 down. I wont touch the big stuff without some coin upfront. Even then I'm still wide open to a good hard screwin' but atleast there's a little something to try and offset the blow.
 
Tucker, I don't quite follow that... Brian said don't set it up where they can break you. That doesn't mean money up front necessarily but it does mean progress payments. I NEVER ask for prepayments but on large projects I always set things up for progress payments. No one is going to beat me out of weeks of work and leave me in financial ruin because I get paid for what I have done every few days. -Failure to pay as arranged is going to stop all further work on their project and I';ll go work for people who pay. Beating me out of 1 week's work would hurt me very badly but it doesn't set up an irrecoverable situation.
 
Yup, Justin understands what I'm saying. Another example would be to go in expecting a 1-2 week delay on pay, then forking out a bunch of money out of pocket to cover labor, then going and signing a purchase contract on a new chipper, then while waiting for your first big check you start getting the runaround and find out they expect you to wait 60-90 days for your money.

Only thieves will make you wait 60-90 days on your money.

Another consideration is giving up all your other clients in order to feed the one monster client. Think about suppliers that sell to Wal-Mart. You give up all your other business in order to concentrate on the 'big' guy only to get slowly squeezed with tighter margins and higher requirements. And in the meantime you've lost most of your other business so you're stuck.

Don't get stuck. ;)
 
What those guys say.....

Your buddy giving you the referral or not, if they won't positively respond to your requirement for a regular pay schedule on a six month project, walk away.
 
What Skwerl said.


Easy day... three Poplar floppers- fed 'em through the chopper.
 
As a further response expanding onwhat Brian was saying..... I have no problem devoting a couple of weeks exclusively to a project-all my other customers can be given projected dates based upon that. On the other hand if a project is going to really tie up a lot of time then I try to build the big project's schedule around the fact that I am primarily a service business with many small account clients. This has really only come up once in recent years but I set it up where the big customer got 3-4 days per week --potentially limited by weather or emergency calls. It just so happened that 3-4 days corresponded to finishing another phase and collecting some on the project as well.:D I then planned on working 6 days per week and spent 2-3 days each week trying to keep up with normal work so that no one was put off an inordinately long time. The large client was okay with that arrangement-everyone got work performed in a timely fashion and, while I got rather tired since some of the "small job" days were quite long, everybody won.
 
Good thought, Stumper. I've been faced with that, a lengthy project that wasn't convenient for other clients who were waiting. Sometimes it's best though, to not ask to be able to split your time, at least until you are some ways into the big project, and the client is comfortable with you being conscientious about completing the work there. If you say right from the start, that you have other jobs as well, that will require some of your time, the big job customer might get antsy about you not showing up. It takes timing and feeling out the situation.
 
I did a job for Salvation Army in Turlock at a senior apartment complex they run and I was paid in 30days. Are you talking about a job that would last 6 months to complete?
 
I disagree, Jay. I think that being very specific right up front saying that you have regular clientelle that also deserve your time and offering to dedicate a specific number of days per week will go a long way towards showing your potential 'big client' that you are conscientious about handling jobs in a timely manner. I'm not talking about a 1-2 week job, but a project that is expected to stretch over several months. They would think of you more as a hired hand if you offered them 5-6 days per week with no stipulations.
 
A few things....... I DO take money upfront on anything very big, and always will. I'm not talking 10,000 dollar jobs, I mean THE BIG STUFF. I also would never walk into something huge without a payment schedule, whether its based on dates, or percentage complete on the work. I DO NOT do the whole 30-90 day wait for payment. My terms of payment are spelled out and legally worded in a contract from the start.
So as to sitting and waiting for a check for six months, my terms on paper, as drawn up by an attorney state a finance charge on anything 30 days past due. Still not bullet proof, but a hair safer.

As to other clients waiting in the meantime while out working a large project.......well, there's a lot to be said there. Understand that i am a YOUNG business and dont have people beating down my door for work like many of you may have. I do my fair share of tree work but i never get booked up a month out. Not yet. On top of all that, times are bad as we all know. Work has not taken off for myself or many of the other tree services in my community as it should have. I anticipate a HARD year ahead for myself. As though things arent slow enough trying to build a name, now I'm battling a major nose dive in the economy. My feelings are that if there was ever a time to take on a large project that would provide stable work for half a year, now is it. My work load is zero at the moment and with that in mind, I MUST do what it takes to keep the lights on. if not for my business or myself, for my family.
 
The only large job I did the govt had the terms all laid out. There was no negotiating, if you didn't want it they would go with the next higher bid.
 
As for payment being on time with the Salvation Army, I do a few weeks of work at the retreat each year, for the last few years and never had the least bit of touble. I actually donate a good portion of time to the retreat and in exchange have keys to a cabin, a boat, and year round use of the 260 acre lake which is forbidden to the public. Now, that doesnt mean life is perfect and there's no chance of getting burned, but my name is gold with the administrators and officers there and they treat me incredibly well.
 
Cool deal, Tucker. I wasn't trying to sound negative and it sounds like you're prepared for taking on this kind of commitment. My ramblings are meant with the best of intentions. I certainly hope it turns out to be a sweet gig for you.
 
Excellent point about the terms being laid out by the other party. I was made aware that i would be laying out the terms.
 
Skwerl, you gave me some excellent advice that i am grateful for. We'll see where it goes. like i said, I may not get the work.
 
Well, Daniel dropped a bit down a push rod tube which made an already screwed up night of wrenching into a hunt for the 1/4" bit. I turned the crank and heard something hit something else inside, what I imagine the bit hitting the oil pan which will be a good thing.

Hopefully we can fish it out with a magnet (he's going to get it) if not we've gotta pull the pan (PITA) which is held on with Torx head bolts (which he's going to buy a set of Torx sockets).

Try not to be jealous of all the fun going on tonight in Mississippi!
 
I left my guys at the job today and they were to bring a few limbs back off of the neighbors and the street and clean up the inside of the tree. It had a bunch of deadwood inside the tree. So I give my guy the speech about don't leave any stubs, don't just face it off, all that. I get a call from the customer about 2:30 in the PM that the guys think they are finished but she wants some more cut off and she isn't paying me all the money as it stands right now. I talk to them and tell them to do whatever she wants. I show up about 3:30 and they are cleaning up and there are stubs all over the place, tree looks like crap and the customer is super happy.
 
I left my guys at the job today and they were to bring a few limbs back off of the neighbors and the street and clean up the inside of the tree. It had a bunch of deadwood inside the tree. So I give my guy the speech about don't leave any stubs, don't just face it off, all that. I get a call from the customer about 2:30 in the PM that the guys think they are finished but she wants some more cut off and she isn't paying me all the money as it stands right now. I talk to them and tell them to do whatever she wants. I show up about 3:30 and they are cleaning up and there are stubs all over the place, tree looks like crap and the customer is super happy.

Kill them all.
 
He did what I told him to do both times. I was actually pretty happy with my trimmer guy. It's when I told him to do whatever the customer wanted that things got ugly, but that's what she wanted. So it's all good. Not much traffic on the street so maybe no one will see.
 
Today was a good day. We didn't finish the third job but that's OK. We added another emergency job this morning, a spruce that had uprooted some in last weeks storm. It was leaning toward the house so we put our fattest climber in the tree and he made quick work of it and we got paid well for 15 minutes of work and no cleanup. Job number two was globe willows with an aviary below. No birds in it but there was this annoying bird netting that tore easily, too easily. Job number three was an easy spruce and a pretty straightforward ash tree to trim. We just ran out of time. I had to be home to watch the kid so my wife could go to her night class at the college. Now I just have to figure out how to fit the rest of it into my schedule. Saturday may have to be a work day. I have been resisting that. Its bad enough doing bids on the weekends. I have not been with the family a lot lately. I am the occasional parent and that is not why I started my own business.
 
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