DRT climb line tie-in on a spar?

[Spellfeller]

Hi, all:

After thinking about it more carefully, I think I've been able to boil my question down to this:

If you are climbing DRT on a split tail and then follow Jepson's advice on page 49 of TTCC and (while secured by a lanyard):

a. pass the working end of the climbing line around the spar
b. clip (biner) or tie in (running bowline) above your friction hitch
c. attach a figure 8 below

You've just switched to SRT, right?

Just trying to decide between the technique HERE (page 3, figure 1) and the one in figure 4, which uses an adjustable ring/ring friction saver. Seems that in terms of equipment costs a rescue 8 is lot cheaper than an AFS...then again an AFS may have more uses?

 

[canadianclimber]

You should check out "the tree climbers companion" by Jeff Jepson. For $14 it's a great little resource when starting out.

 

[Spellfeller]

It IS a great resource!

I have all of Jepson's books, and it may be that the answer was right under my nose on page 49. I'm just having a hard time reconciling that paragraph with a source I found on the web.

I'll edit the original post...

 

[chris_girard]

What's the problem again?

 

[Bermy]

Choking a spar on DdRT...I found the best solution was to take up a ring/ring friction saver and a spare prussic loop.
Wrap the prussic loop on the large ring side of your FS, clip a biner into it, this becomes adjustable by sliding it along the webbing of the FS. The biner replaces the large ring.
So choke the FS snug to the tree, line up the small ring and the biner on the prussic, put you climb line through as normal and re-attach.

As you come down you can easily slack off the prussic, shake the FS down a bit, snug up the prussic again, and continue.
I also always have my lanyard around the tree too...always test the system with another attachment point secured before you commit to it and detach anything else.

I found the method of putting in a fig 8 too cumbersome and you have to hard lock it somehow if you want to stop and do work on the way down. A blakes will lock up on a single line if part of your weight isn't supported by the Fig 8.

 

[Sgriff]

I also use my adjustable friction saver for this while ddrt,i keep the rings at half way point of trunk(or less even)so my rope and hitch have plenty room to snug down,i just adjust my hitch to gain slack vs adjusting my fs. Works a charm,very easy to slack ,move ,and adjust .(this is my method for moving along a spar that i am removing,if im choking a spar to work off of i do set it differently)

 

[sawman]

Thank god for srt devices!!

 

[SouthSoundTree-]

Yep

 

[Spellfeller]

Guys, is that to say that using an SRT device makes this a much simpler issue to address?

 

[Raj]

Ohhh yeah it does! I think you were warned before, any thing left in the garage to sell??

 

[Sgriff]

The difference in simplicity for this particular application ,imo,is minimal.
Srt is bitchin but at the point im cinching onto a spar,I could care less and the act of the entire process is mirror to me.

 

[Spellfeller]

Running out of motorcycles, Peter, but give me some ideas anyway (for future use, of course)!

What SRT gizmo is your favorite?

 

[Raj]

I'm a HH guy, love it so much I have 2, don't wanna be without it!

 

[SouthSoundTree-]

dollar for dollar, HH2. I run a HH. Jaime's Akimbo is looking wild.

 

[canadianclimber]

For working down a spar I use a grigri. Simple

 

[stig]

Don't let the born again SRT boys (and girl) tell you that DRT doesn't work.
That is bull.
It has worked fine for some of us during long careers in treework.
Just because there is a new kid on the block, doesn't mean the old way doesn't work.

Get an adjustable Friction saver to use for spar work and you'll be golden.

As for Jepson, I bought his first book, read the stuff on the inside of the jacket and tossed it out.
Should I believe anything a guy, who in earnest believes that God saved him from dying from a fall out of a jack pine, says about climbing safety.
Rather not, thank you.
Just like I don't often take the friction knot advice of guys who claim they can talk with their garden gnomes.

Oh BTW, I climb both SRT and DRT. Each has it's good sides and applications.

 

[Raj]

I'm sorry....

Who's talking with gnomes?!?!

 

[treebilly]

We have a guy on a landscape crew who looks like a giant garden gnome.

Ddrt works great and should be known by all of us. Like Stig stated both systems have their own advantages. I use the HH for both and switch back and forth during a climb some days

 

[SouthSoundTree-]

DdRT is a necessary component in tree work. I'd rather largely use a system that avoids problematic friction in the first place, than managing it.

On tall trees, I really, really prefer not to be stuck off the ground by not having a long enough rope to reach the ground in one shot (lots of 130' FIR removals this summer). I also don't want to get stuck part way down in an emergency (I speed exited a tree this summer because of wasps, and dealt with them F-ers two other times this summer) because of something l like a branch or stub snagging on the rope. I usually switch to DdRT for descent (sorts like a lot of people use SRT only for ascent).

 

[DMc]

Don't let the born again SRT boys (and girl) tell you that DRT doesn't work.
That is bull. It has worked fine for some of us during long careers in treework.
Just because there is a new kid on the block, doesn't mean the old way doesn't work....

Well, I'm your huckleberry. I don't recall ever hearing any climber saying that DdRT doesn't work. It works well and has some fine attributes. It has, however, become an option for tree work. A choice.

DdRT reminds me of an axe. It also still works and works well. It can be a joy to use. So how many of us grab an axe when it is time for the cut?

 

[Raj]

IMHO srt solves a lot of problems, use a suitable PSP for my main HH line, use a second climb line DdRT to pull myself up/out to a difficult spot, redirect the single line, and get to work.

 

[Sgriff]

whats the special method of choking a spar srt that is so much simpler and faster?

 

[CurSedVoyce]

I just girth hitch it with a biner or running bowline. That way I can just bail with out any extra set up or gear. Avoids the circle of death that way too I guess. But if I need to bail.. don't much care about line retrieval. No fig 8 or what not required.

 

[Raj]

AB, quicklink and choke spar. My canopy anchor I use.

 

[SouthSoundTree-]

I just girth hitch it with a biner or running bowline. That way I can just bail with out any extra set up or gear. Avoids the circle of death that way too I guess. But if I need to bail.. don't much care about line retrieval. No fig 8 or what not required.

Same here. For final descent, I use a pull down line set using the tail of the climbing rope or second line tied to the biner, for me.

As with a ring and ring friction saver on a spar, pulling outward as much as possible, rather than down, aids retrieval from the ground. Worth a practice run before descending, if in double. Anticipate the rope angle from the ground. Choke loosely, yet securely. Don't choke so that the choking circle of rope is horizontal and as small as possible. Leave it looser, descend a little bit, loosen to the point that it is secure, but a large downward-pointed oval choking loop.