Rigging Question

[SkwerI]

Justin, it's a quickie shortcut when you can get away with it and don't want to spend the time incorporating a second rope (or don't have a second rope available). I could see myself using something like this by simply throwing a loop runner around the limb and then clipping it back on the running end of the lowering line. Boom, 10 seconds invested and you give the groundie some leverage to swing the limb.

 

[MasterBlaster]

Can't say that I've ever seen a shackle used as a lowering device.

I've done it, it works, although the bend radius ain't the best thing for the bullrope. And it's not a "lowering" device, it's a false crotch.

 

[CurSedVoyce]

Se far we have only used the base of a tree nearby for the porty at (A). But we figure we could rig something else if necessary. Loop runners and biners set this up fast, yes it is a quick shortcut.
I have only dropped probably close to 300# at present on this and would have to look at getting some blocks to see how it does with heavier weight. It is not exact like a tag line, but very gentle And is similar to a drift line in function just with a limitation on the drift. And you will find that it will be on the ground before it ever tries to swing back to the tree, in fact it more glides down.. Like I said, just a quick shortcut but hey it works..
We will get some pics as we test the limits of the idea in the back yard... Good to have practice trees

 

[lumberjack]

So four pulleys are involved?

GRCS? I'd love to know the % of tree companies with one of those. I bet it's like 3%.

3. One for the main line, one for the drift line to run over, and the third pulley on the end of the second line with the main line running through it.

There's nearly 1k GRCS's in existence. I'm fine with being in the minority.

 

[MasterBlaster]

Ahh, for a second there I was thinking it was a tad over-complicated, ha!

 

[arborworks1]

I'll take the minority also.

Bivy must be on serious government aid!

Small companies benefit greatly by the ability of the grcs!

 

[gf beranek]

Only 1,000 GRCS's in use? And how many tree services? Something is wrong. Must be most tree services don't do rigging I guess.

 

[MasterBlaster]

Must be most tree services don't do rigging I guess.

I bet you meant that tongue in cheek, but it wouldn't surprise me a bit if there wasn't a bit of truth to that. Now factor in the ratio that will be willing to drop the bucks for one.

 

[squisher]

It's just at that price I'm used to getting a motor!

 

[gf beranek]

Dropping the bucks for a GRCS has long been the limiting factor why more tree services don't have them. But it is a classic example of false economy. The capabilities of the machine pays for itself many times over within the first year.

Out of sight. Out of mind.

 

[CurSedVoyce]

If our company keeps expanding in the tree work dept. as progressively as we have been, I would definitely consider dropping the money on a GRCS. I would also have to see I would need it for the trees we do here. More often than not, I can say a GRCS was not needed on the job thus far. I would wait till I saw the opportunity to use it and help pay for itself right off the get go. Then like everything else... It would just get more work since I had it

 

[lumberjack]

Ahh, for a second there I was thinking it was a tad over-complicated, ha!

Haha.

With that setup you can move the main line's rigging point around by adjusting the second line's length before lifting with the main line.

Only "needed" it once, made major bank doing it.

 

[PCTREE]

OK so just read through new posts. KISS system looks slick but the only slight concern I would have is that you are putting the tree under side load instead of compression if you just lowered the piece. Wood is very strong under compresion. We often find ourselves working in structurally compomized trees and a large side load such as this could be problematic.....I for one would NEVER do anything dangerous.

On the GRCS issue, so years ago I saw the GRCS and thought to myself "self thats slick" but couldnt justify the loot. Picked up a winch on ebay for $300 and made one. We have used it some. Mostly it sits in the truck. My groundie hates to get it out as it is heavy! and in my experience I really think a good climber can just take smaller pieces and get it to work. One thing I have noticed when we use it is we tend to go BIGGER with all of our cuts. Just seems to me as you go bigger then assosciated problems/consequences become bigger too. I have often wondered if folks use it/ love it so much because they spent $2500:roll: where as I didnt spend much and dont use it much......

 

[JIML]

Only 1,000 GRCS's in use? And how many tree services?

Hell we got 6 bucket trucks and a manual crew and don't even have a porty :what::what:

Some days we may be rigging all day and others not even get a rope out.

 

[Old Monkey]

I bought the GRCS and think it was worth it. I use it once or twice a month. When I use it saves me loads of time and physical abuse. It also allows me to do some jobs I just wouldn't do without it.

 

[PCTREE]

Darin what does it enable you to do that you couldnt do without it??

Just playing Devils advocate and I might just be misssing the point

 

[rbtree]

Darin what does it enable you to do that you couldnt do without it??

Just playing Devils advocate and I might just be misssing the point

I ain't Darin.....but the GRCS allows load lifting which makes many procedures easier.....for storm work, it is indispensable. Low limbs over buildings, swinging branches away from obstacles...etc etc.

Sure, there's other options....but none are as convenient to use---5-1 fiddle block set up to tension and lift.....chipper winch, truck winch.....climbing out and cutting small.

 

[CurSedVoyce]

OK so just read through new posts. KISS system looks slick but the only slight concern I would have is that you are putting the tree under side load instead of compression if you just lowered the piece. Wood is very strong under compresion. We often find ourselves working in structurally compomized trees and a large side load such as this could be problematic.....I for one would NEVER do anything dangerous.

Good point on the side loading.. And as I completely over looked it.. DOH, so that answers the heavier loading question. Have to keep it with in reason.
Thanks PC.

I do only use this in special circumstances I will point out again, with pretty light loads.
Well, we still need to get out back and do some with it so some pics can be taken. See If I can by Monday or something.


And I can see on the GCRS issue where companies may not go there. Rigging and smaller cuts go a long way. Now if I were taking down a large ponderosa or valley oak up here, and it really required the control the GRCS can provide, both lifting and lowering, I can see it very useful. But, the issue of how often I have a situation like this next to a house or what not... I would have to just be in trees every day to warrant it.

 

[lumberjack]

Wood is strong under tension, weak under compression.

I only use mine a dozen hours a year or so and it still makes me enough money I could replace it each year. Sure, you could do it another way almost every time. I'm completely fine with you doing that.

If I didn't have a manlift that can reach 80%+ of my work, I'd have 2 GRCS's in a heartbeat.

Less than 2 hours, $1200. $800 less than the next lowest estimate.

 

[MasterBlaster]

Wood is strong under tension, weak under compression.

Huh?

 

[brendonv]

Darin what does it enable you to do that you couldnt do without it??

Just playing Devils advocate and I might just be missing the point

It's easier and less time consuming when using it to lift horizontal limbs, and I've lifted some biggies. Pulling over severely back leaning trees, and lifting stalks from storm damaged. It's nice when your working on a tree in the middle of others because if the limb gets stuck on the way down, just lift it out and re-lower. I was scared to drop the $$ on it at first, but it opens up way more possibilities once you have it.

Of course there are other ways to do the above, but there's less involved for the ground guy with the grcs, just put it in the self tailer and crank away.

 

[PCTREE]

Dont get me wrong, as I stated I have a GRCS(of sorts) but we just dont seem to use it much. If I need to lift Big stuff we usually put the porty on the dingo or wheel loader and pull it with that ( if we have it on the job). I will give you that it is nice when you get a piece hung up to be able to pick it up without switching setups.

How the F### is wood weak under compression????

Next Im going to start arguing that nobody needs a motorized ascender when you can just use 2 regular ascenders

 

[rbtree]

I just edited and uploaded this video, of us felling some firs and yarding some brush out of the woods with the GRCS, tensioning the preset pull lines, temporarily using them as a "reverse speed line"

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[Stumper]

Wood is strong under tension, weak under compression.

URL]

Carl, Youu don't usually make such uselessly inaccurate broad general statements of bafflingly oblique relevance. What's wrong with you?

 

[rbtree]

looks slick but the only slight concern I would have is that you are putting the tree under side load instead of compression if you just lowered the piece. Wood is very strong under compresion. We often find ourselves working in structurally compomized trees and a large side load such as this could be problematic....

Se my post #38..... I posted the same fear....side loading forces must be accounted for...no problem if the stem is strong....option is a backguy.

Peter Donzelli died when lowering a top of a lightning struck stem, by side loading it- the groundies ran wraps off another tree way off to the side.....