CurSedVoyce
California Hillbilly
Great diagram though. Text book style of bucking the big log.
Big bucks...I mean really big bucks
- Thread starter woodworkingboy
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Great diagram though. Text book style of bucking the big log.
sawinredneck
Treehouser
Just a firewood cut here, but what is wrong with cutting down half way, then just cutting up to finish it?
It can, and does catch on the top, but limits bar pinching.
It can, and does catch on the top, but limits bar pinching.
CurSedVoyce
California Hillbilly
Undercutting can be a bit much with a big saw for most and not as advisable. Ever have an 066 push you backwards?
Old Monkey
Treehouser
- Joined
- Mar 9, 2005
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- 8,764
That and it can be hard on a big piece to match your cuts bottom to top.
thattreeguy
TreeHouser
Yeah, doesnt it feel great,
its right up there with the old manual stump grinder handle bar to the ribs
CurSedVoyce
California Hillbilly
Uh HUH.. you know it! Had a ponderosa once I fell sweet.. downside was that it was seriously bridged. Back cut (under cut) that sucka from one end to the point it landed on the flat. Well inclined anyway. Was head high most the way... Only place I could lay it down in. Right in between two other trees (ponderosa) that weren't 15 feet apart. Best fall I ever did and really scared me buckin it. Never been pushed off my feet but damn close in my early times.
sotc
Dormant hero!!
Andy, another problem is committing the whole bar to a cut that may have multiple points of pressure or twist. This method often releives these different points or at least gives you a chance to see and react to a bind before your stuck
CurSedVoyce
California Hillbilly
I still place a wedge in the top portion of the cut... I don't really hammer it in. Just snug it to keep the kerf from closing. Old habit I guess. Just my OCD about pinch.
CurSedVoyce
California Hillbilly
I did this 42DBH black oak more with that method as I learned it. Much easier than undercutting and I used a wedge each cut just for measure. 
We hit something in part of it... Never did find out what. That is why the cuts look a bit crooked. O66 did most of the trunk save some of the finish cuts when it was on the terra firma. Once we hit the God knows what... we switched to a smaller saw to finish the cuts. Cheaper chain
We hit something in part of it... Never did find out what. That is why the cuts look a bit crooked. O66 did most of the trunk save some of the finish cuts when it was on the terra firma. Once we hit the God knows what... we switched to a smaller saw to finish the cuts. Cheaper chain
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MasterBlaster
Administrator Emeritus
sawinredneck
Treehouser
Thanks Willie, that explains it the best.
And no, the largest saw I have run is the 046 with a 32". I've had it push with the 25" on it, it was controlable. But certainly not pleasant!
This is why you ask, now I know LOTS of reasons it's a bad idea
woodworkingboy
TreeHouser
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #38
I was originally wondering about big logs sitting directly on the ground, or close enough to it, so that there is no apparent top or bottom bind, and sometimes that small amount of settling that can take place when you finish the cut, or a little rolling, will pinch the bar.
Top hopper's way of leaving that little holding strap in the middle, and after cutting through the bottom, cutting the strap on the way back up, that sounds really good.
Top hopper's way of leaving that little holding strap in the middle, and after cutting through the bottom, cutting the strap on the way back up, that sounds really good.
Reddog
TreeHouser
If it is a large log laying flat and I can't read any bind, I will bore cut it and leave three small areas holding.
Then go and release each one and see if a bind starts to show it's self.
I will normally leave these at the top and sides.
For me cutting hardwood, fiber pull in the outer layers is better than in the center.
Then go and release each one and see if a bind starts to show it's self.
I will normally leave these at the top and sides.
For me cutting hardwood, fiber pull in the outer layers is better than in the center.
Burnham
Woods walker
Great discussion, and Willie's diagram is a good one.
I'm with Darin in that I always reach over, or climb up on top, and buck off about one third on the offside.
If you have big, heavy wood, or extreme bind top or bottom, it can be a good idea to remove a wedge-shaped piece to allow room for the kerf to close into as you finish the cut...this allows things to settle more slowly and easy.
The ream technique I use is to buck until I see the kerf begin to close, pull out and then bore right back in at the same location and procede a little further, allowing the kerf to close above the bar...maybe do this twice or even three times until the kerf at the outer edge of the log is closed tight, then it can't close any more and you can proceed with the cut with no further pinch being likely.
Watch the kerf! The log will speak to you.
Bucking logs to mill lengths puts you in heavier binds than bucking to handleable size, or firewood. It's really a different animal. Side bind is far more likely to rear it's ugly head, and 41 footers can kill you easy...be watchful of where you stand, and be quick to switchhit so you are in a safe place.
Steeper ground always offers up likely end bind, too. Reaming/ boring to leave wood holding the kerf open is best here...wedges tend to be less effective, I think, as the log hunts for wherever movement together is possible and just goes closed opposite the wedge-top, bottom, or sides.
I'm with Darin in that I always reach over, or climb up on top, and buck off about one third on the offside.
If you have big, heavy wood, or extreme bind top or bottom, it can be a good idea to remove a wedge-shaped piece to allow room for the kerf to close into as you finish the cut...this allows things to settle more slowly and easy.
The ream technique I use is to buck until I see the kerf begin to close, pull out and then bore right back in at the same location and procede a little further, allowing the kerf to close above the bar...maybe do this twice or even three times until the kerf at the outer edge of the log is closed tight, then it can't close any more and you can proceed with the cut with no further pinch being likely.
Watch the kerf! The log will speak to you.
Bucking logs to mill lengths puts you in heavier binds than bucking to handleable size, or firewood. It's really a different animal. Side bind is far more likely to rear it's ugly head, and 41 footers can kill you easy...be watchful of where you stand, and be quick to switchhit so you are in a safe place.
Steeper ground always offers up likely end bind, too. Reaming/ boring to leave wood holding the kerf open is best here...wedges tend to be less effective, I think, as the log hunts for wherever movement together is possible and just goes closed opposite the wedge-top, bottom, or sides.
Ed L
Treehouser
Burnham, while I will sometimes use the reaming tecnique, I find pounding in a couple or more wedges both easier and safer if the log is bending downwards.
If you have a large log lying flat on the ground, without any apparent tension, you can cut it from the top down, set a couple of wedges in the top of the cut and just before you are all the way through, hammer the wedges as far in as they'll go. this will make the log rise up from the ground and save you from ruining the chain.
Sometimes you have to alternate between cutting and hammering a little in order to get the desired effect. You can only make the log rise if the strap of wood holding it is fairly thin, like 5" or so.
If you have a large log lying flat on the ground, without any apparent tension, you can cut it from the top down, set a couple of wedges in the top of the cut and just before you are all the way through, hammer the wedges as far in as they'll go. this will make the log rise up from the ground and save you from ruining the chain.
Sometimes you have to alternate between cutting and hammering a little in order to get the desired effect. You can only make the log rise if the strap of wood holding it is fairly thin, like 5" or so.
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Burnham
Woods walker
I don't disagree, Stig...and have once or twice (or maybe a few more times 
) misjudged the point of no return and regreted it.
Wedges are a wonderfully powerful tool, and with really big bucks in heavy logs I probably use them more than any other technique.
Looking back over this thread, I see I wandered rather far afield from Jay's original question.
) misjudged the point of no return and regreted it. Wedges are a wonderfully powerful tool, and with really big bucks in heavy logs I probably use them more than any other technique.
Looking back over this thread, I see I wandered rather far afield from Jay's original question
.
Al Smith
Mac Daddy
Not living in hill county I really have no idea how to lop a big log .In the flat lands a couple of wedges usually gets it done .
Seldom though does it exceed 3 to 3 1/2 foot cut .Those in that size are a rarity in themselves .
Seldom though does it exceed 3 to 3 1/2 foot cut .Those in that size are a rarity in themselves .
SkwerI
Treehouser
Burnham, your wanderings are always enjoyable as well as informative. Wander all you like!
woodworkingboy
TreeHouser
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #46
Burnham, you wander, we ponder
Interesting technique, Stig, on the lift up from the ground with a wedge.
Some crane removals around private residences we do here, mostly tall pines, the tree gets lain down and bucked up in the street. Sometimes even when sitting on the upper limbs, the lower portion of the trunk will have bent and be sitting directly on the concrete. Have nicked more than one chain on those. A little lift off the pavement would come in handy sometimes, and not having to wait for the mini to come around.
Interesting technique, Stig, on the lift up from the ground with a wedge.
Some crane removals around private residences we do here, mostly tall pines, the tree gets lain down and bucked up in the street. Sometimes even when sitting on the upper limbs, the lower portion of the trunk will have bent and be sitting directly on the concrete. Have nicked more than one chain on those. A little lift off the pavement would come in handy sometimes, and not having to wait for the mini to come around.
B
Buckadoo1
Guest
Gentlemen,
I like all that has been said. My method of making Big cuts with some down pressure is to go over the top and get your far wood first(the red in the diagram).Then underbuck it a little,just nip the skin to keep er from slabbing.Then come down from the top reaming like crazy,"work it like a hand saw"is what my old man used to say.you should be able to feel your tip meeting your far side cut,Just come down through er till she pops loose.As far as flat ground goes I haven't got much experience there but I would go with the wedge in the top,and beat er in tight.anyway thats my two cents
I like all that has been said. My method of making Big cuts with some down pressure is to go over the top and get your far wood first(the red in the diagram).Then underbuck it a little,just nip the skin to keep er from slabbing.Then come down from the top reaming like crazy,"work it like a hand saw"is what my old man used to say.you should be able to feel your tip meeting your far side cut,Just come down through er till she pops loose.As far as flat ground goes I haven't got much experience there but I would go with the wedge in the top,and beat er in tight.anyway thats my two cents
B
Buckadoo1
Guest
Ed,
Now that is a whole lotta saw you got there!
Now that is a whole lotta saw you got there!
B
Buckadoo1
Guest
Gord,
Love your show.I have worked with some Cannuks,I bullbucked a cutting crew for Coulson Aircrane one year in AK.I like how you guys do things.Stay safe G.
Love your show.I have worked with some Cannuks,I bullbucked a cutting crew for Coulson Aircrane one year in AK.I like how you guys do things.Stay safe G.
Paul B
I dig hammocks.
cool, I just learned that one last week, the whole class was surprised when one wedge lifted the cedar log the instructor was bucking, , pretty cool.
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