Tree Care in Developing Nations

[bonner1040]

So having visited India, Mexico, and now Costa Rica it is obvious that tree care standards are not the same in some developing nations as here in the United States.

I have always dreamed of moving somewhere exotic and Meg was somewhat taken by Costa Rica and I really liked it as well.

What is the possibility of running a US standard (safety, quality, productivity) tree service in a developing nation? Having seen the aftermath of two tree removals recently in Costa Rica and the general standard of quality in street and private trees otherwhere in the world its evident that it might be an uphill battle.

What interests me at present is 2 groups, the really rich and the impossible situations.

Really Rich: people with money want manicured properties wherever they live, someone has to the high end pruning right? If its not being done the possibility is there to educate and create demand through sales.

Impossibles: From talking to people during my travels I get the impression that certain trees, that need removed just aren't, because the expertise or ability is lacked due to surroundings. I was also given the impression that doing tree work the way we do here is pretty much unheard of in developing countries. My vision is an 'elite team' that could travel Central America and do the big, the dangerous, the horribles, and the monsters, the trees others 'cant' do thus commanding a high rate. (Think the Graeme McMahon of Latin America)


What do you guys think?

Nick? Fiona? Others?

 

[bonner1040]

A search for "Costa Rica Tree Service' yields only these results:

http://www.sustainabletreeservicescostarica.com/ (claims to be the ONLY certified arborist in CR)

http://www.sweattdemolitionco.com/fire-damage-clearing (mostly demo it seems, not what I am talking about)

 

[MasterBlaster]

Leon should have something to say about this. Cool thread.

 

[stig]

Nick, you are being spoiled by living in a country where people actually pay to have trees taken care of.

I don't consider Denmark a developing country ( is there some thing like the opposite? entropying countries!) But we rarely have the chance to do pruning/thinning jobs here, nobody wants to spend the money, outside of really big corporations, government and the super rich national church.

Big dangerous monster trees that need removed aren't because of the cost. Better to let them crash into a house and let insurance eat it.

In my 30+ years in the business, I've only ever had a couple of jobs in the $5000+ range.

10 years ago I gave a price of $12000 for removing a partly dying, huge beech squeezed incredibly tight between two houses in the area on the North coast where the super rich live.

Both houses worth in excess of $ 5 million.

The tree is still standing! But only barely.

I don't think you'll find the mindset in Costa Rica to pay big bucks. It is a jungle country, trees are a nuisance.

I'll ask Richard, my South African partner. Being from a 3rd world country, he might have some insight.

 

[top_notch]

Interesting thread, I think the tree team should arrive in a Blackhawk Helocopter! It would be so sweet to travel to another country, for the sole reason of doing some tree work...and making some coin. Then party down!

 

[rumination]

What Stig said. The money isn't there for a traveling dream team tackling impossible monster trees. Not even in the developed world.

Catering to the super rich is slightly more possible. But the conditions would have to be just right. Lots of large estates, with biggish trees, and a high value placed on manicured landscaping. Even if you manage to get established somewhere doing this kind of work don't expect the good times to last for more than a few years. Local folks will quickly pick up on the new industry opportunity and get educated on how to do it themselves, and often that will be the very people that you trained to work for you. Very soon you will be getting underbid on every job.

And starting a new business in a new country is no easy feat. Especially in third world countries having good local connections and networks is vital.

I don't want to sound totally negative and say it isn't possible. But it wouldn't necessarily be easily done. If you wanted to give a go, I'd certainly wish you all the best! And if you ended up needing some help I might even be available.

 

[rumination]

As a second thought, considering the ex-pat population down in Costa Rica, I'm guessing there may be several arborists down there already trying to serve that niche market. I know that forestry is already a big time hobby for ex-pat landowners down there.

 

[PCTREE]

My crane operator owns a house in Costa Rica and he just had a hug tree cut down from over his house and the power lines. He said it was scarry to see as the dude used ladders and no ropes and cut and chucked it all. Took him about a week for $700 US

 

[bonner1040]

Took him about a week for $700 US

ewwww!

 

[Adam_P]

Nick, your buddy Tom on the buzz does some sort of tree work when he's down in Mexico.

I'm not sure if he just trains guys or has a crew down there but he would be able to give you an idea of the market down there.

 

[bonner1040]

My buddy Tom?

 

[Adam_P]

tomthetreeman

 

[MasterBlaster]

Not Tom Dunlap?

 

[Adam_P]

Nope, that's YOUR buddy right Butch?

 

[bonner1040]

Tom D and I dont get along ever since I put a link to the Treehouse in my Treebuzz signature..

He said the only way it would be acceptable would be if I had a mirrored link to treebuzz in my signature here at the House. I actually considered it seeing as I believe treebuzz attracts more NEW members than we do here. My thought being that it might sway more of their members to check out the House while at the same time we wouldnt be losing any members...

 

[MasterBlaster]

He's pissed at me because I didn't want a visit from him, the pompous bastid.

 

[canadiantreeman]

Nick, Shady Lane Tree Care out of the Greater Toronto Area has a principal who spends time at a vacation property in Costa Rica. My good friend who lives on the island is close with this principal and has been invited several times. It might be worth it to phone and ask for John, and let whomever you speak with know that you are interested in analyzing the viability of starting your own service in Costa Rica. Another avenue to take would be a work exchange program with municipal, provincial (state) or federal government, which could probably be arranged through Davey. I assume they have power lines down there, so I would also assume they have a vegetation management plan. Whether its a bunch of yahoos with machetes or a somewhat standardized stratum of trained professionals is not something I'm aware of, but it sure would be interesting to look into. Also, high end resorts may have the need to maintain tree inventories as well, so it might be a good idea to do some fact checking with them.

I am, however, aware that the Costa Rican government subsidizes property owners whose land borders watersheds to maintain the vegetation in a natural state, as it is considered to be water treatment and economically imperative. The prospect of creating a career in the care of trees into a country where such a progressive policy is enacted is exciting.

I think the viability is there, I also think the awareness of the importance of trees is there as well. It is up to you to make it happen. The only problem is that you are probably not papered to the extent that someone who has an urban forestry degree and some technical rope access training is (forgive me if I'm mistaken), which would make it a tough sell. The advantage is that you have a skill set that is likely far above and beyond what is known locally. I do believe that the country is host to a great deal of canopy research as well, so I would imagine that there are some rope access technicians with skillz down there.

This is certainly something that I've dreamed of as well! Oh, a discussion with your local ISA or TCIA representative might yield some insight into the idea of whether there is/are some programs in place already!

 

[treelooker]

I've sold work in oz, hoing kong, singapore etc. and around the caribbean. Seldom can charge US rate, insurance can get prohibitive. have found some sub work by contacting arbs through ISA chapters. no college needed--ISA certs are, well, international. if i cover vacation expenses i consider that a success; would not want to try to make a living that way.

i get a little nervous when people say they need to teach other cultures how to manage tree risk. propping for instance is superior in europe and asia to that done in the US imo. but some of the pruning (2nd and 3rd pics) is horrendous.

 

[Reddog]

The amount of wheel greasing it takes in SA to get any thing done would eat up profits.

 

[Bermy]

Well, I brought UK qualifications to Bermuda, and trained locals successfully.
BUT: I am Bermudian, City & Guilds qualifications are WELL known and respected, and Bermuda is British. Also consumers are increasingly more sophisticated and aware of why good treework is necessary.

If your consumer doesn't care, then it's an uphill battle.
Also as a 'foreigner' it might be tricky...permits and so forth.
What other country are they most closely aligned to? US, UK, Mexico, Europe???...what training or qualifications exist there than can be most easily transferred?

However if the 'powers that be' are looking at regularizing job standards, then you might have a chance. In Bermuda no training or certification is legally required in our field...yet, but it is gradually being implemented for trades, so Gov't departments and forward thinking private companies were taking up my training to be ahead of the coming requirements, or to be able to market thamselves as having certification, not just hackers and slashers.

I reckon you'd have to make the approach armed with some kind of 'papers' that you could offer at the end of any kind of training or to show that makes you stand out as different from whomever is already there.. These days people want something that is tradeable and recognizable internationally. ISA/TCIA or your proven training and experience with the internationally recognized company you work for. I have NPTC / City & Guilds / Lantra in my pocket, trust me it helps.

So there are several levels to look at

Straight out work:
Private consumers (ok if they want or need your service)

Training:
Existing businesses (helping them become more professional, finite opportunity for you as they become proficient and no longer need you)
School (trade training for future career opportunitites, but that's driven by the market)
Government (opening their eyes to H&S and best practice...)

Hey, its worth having a look at, might work, might not!

 

[Al Smith]

I'm thinking much after the fact that perhaps the Easter Islanders might have practised more prudency in tree care than they did .It didn't work out too well for them as the story goes .

 

[OTGBOSTON]

My buddy Tom?

Thomas Morra, you can find him on my FB. Super nice guy he trains local municipal workers in Mexico if I'm not mistaken. Seems like a good niche to train the locals instead of trying to take business from them...

 

[bonner1040]

The training angle is nice, I like that.

 

[bonner1040]

Nick, Shady Lane Tree Care out of ....

Thanks Dylan!

 

[Brock Mayo]

Cambodia has their own way of doing things when it comes to tree removal. Someone with a big saw and some spurs could start a tree work revolution!