GRCS Rope Issues

[chris_girard]

Well, we keep having issues when letting pieces run, with having our rope hockle and cross over itself, basically locking the piece in place. We then have a hard time getting it unstuck and running again. I have spoken with Greg Good about this before and I believe my guys are operating the GRCS in the correct manner, but we are still having problems.

We usually run 1/2" double braid (Samson or All Gear), but have also had hockle issues with 9/16" line. Has anyone else had/having problems?

 

[Altissimus]

Though it doesn't go out as much it probably should .... Never had any problems like you describe. Several different people on the ground took right to it with ten minute training. Are you using the Aluminum Bollard ? Usually we don't bother switching to it.

 

[MasterBlaster]

Has this always happened? And if not, what are you doing differently now?

 

[Jomo]

Feed angle's gotta be just right or else, regardless of whether feeding a Hobbs or GRCS IME.

Jomo

 

[sotc]

Are they using the fairlead into the drum and the pig tail to feed out of the drum? If so the only thing I can think of is running the rope so fast it's backlashing.

 

[Altissimus]

In my experience the figure of eight when used to lower was a venemous line hockler. Gave it away.

 

[Jomo]

When you let a load run, all new rope being fed onto the bollard must enter from the outermost edge of the spool, or the rope'll cross over itself n hockle almost invariably. Making it imperative to use a fairlead captive eye that insures the ropes fed onto the spools outer most edge, regardless of your groundie's grasp of how critical proper feed angle's are to smooth consistent rigging.

Jomo

 

[Sgriff]

If the fairlead/pigtail are being used properly i would suggest you have too many wraps on the bollard for running purposes.

 

[squisher]

The fair leads are straight?

 

[kevin bingham]

The Harkin winch in my opinion should never be used to " let it run. Only for static lifts. When lowering on the Harkin very slowly. We have a rule that one person watches the winch bollard while lowering and doesn't take their eye off of it and lowers very slow and controlled. Another person doesn't tale their eye off the piece and communicates in detail to the grcs operator. For non static lifts we use aluminum bollard or the porta wrap which is also mandatory installed on all removals. Prior to cutting be done.

 

[Sgriff]

The creator of grcs runs the shnit out of his harken,lets it run so much that all the embossed traction marks wore off,I couldn't get any of the same wear when I tried.

 

[Altissimus]

Main reason we don't switch out is some pieces need a combination of running and hoisting to get them down safely. Not very practical to switch ... The Harken can definitely take it no problem.

 

[Sgriff]

^ 👍

 

[kevin bingham]

Maybe but, you cross over just once like chris is describing and your fooked. If you do then you are definitly going to want that Porta wrap on the tree. But seriously how much lifting you guys do? When I need to lift, the grcs is my best friend in the world but it's sorta rare that its a better option than standard shock free top rope style lowering. For that the aluminum bollard is so nice. The porta wrap is better at that then the harken winch.
They are not made for that. You don't see sailors drop chumls or do negative rigging on them. Why would you shock load a precision 2500 tool, when sturdier, better, safer and cheaper options exist right there.

I have had a couple scary experiences with the grcs using it in place of a meant for purpose lowering device and decided it's not worth it. Those pigtails should not see any rope at all as well, they can bend and break if they see unexpected force. My grounds men one was standing at an angle to the device and was including the friction provided by the pigtail into his wrap calculations. It snapped the pigtail off and the wraps flew off and he flew into it. Lots of bad decisions were made but I decided the grcs is a highly valuable but complicated device that requires I tensile training and concentration. I can put my mother on the porta wrap or the aluminum bollard.

 

[kevin bingham]

This decision was made after also experience the cross o have also experienceing the cross over situation a few times and it really sucks and is very dangerous and scary. Not a situation to taken lightly. It must be approached without careful planning and thought. Just not worth it IMO.

 

[sotc]

We rarely use the aluminum bollard, we bomb the heck out of the winches with no trouble. Sold my porty to Love Nick years ago and haven't missed it. To each their own

 

[flushcut]

I let it run a lot on the Harken all the time with no issues. I had the rope bind up on a Hobbs pretty bad. I think it's all about line angle coming into the drum.

 

[Marc-Antoine]

You can do that even with the porty during slown lowering. Just pass the 90° angle with the tail and you are good for a Oh-shit moment.

 

[Altissimus]

Well, we keep having issues when letting pieces run, with having our rope hockle and cross over itself, basically locking the piece in place. We then have a hard time getting it unstuck and running again. I have spoken with Greg Good about this before and I believe my guys are operating the GRCS in the correct manner, but we are still having problems.

We usually run 1/2" double braid (Samson or All Gear), but have also had hockle issues with 9/16" line. Has anyone else had/having problems?

....uhmmm Chris , way to stay with the thread man. What did Gregg say ?

 

[sotc]

He's trying to untie melted ropes

 

[Porkbrick]

i had the very same problem on my grcs and finally tracked it down to the plastic end cap which is the rope grab ring. if the plastic is worn down just a little it wont meet the aluminum flush and that edge will pull the rope wraps out of whack. $25 at westmarine for a new rope grab fixed the problem and no crossed rope since.

 

[Jed]

Hey Chris: Please forgive an inbredJed answer to the problem, but seriously... It's my belief that if you'd just leave the 900 foot bull rope in the shed for the time when Babe and the Blue Ox finally have to run ropes... you'll be o.k. In other words: Trim down the length of the line for the size of the tree that you're doing, and suddenly... all the bad issues go away. The end of that line's gotta be able to SPIN man. I seen it a hundred times.

 

[flushcut]

uhhh Babe is the blue ox. Born in the winter of the blue fire and was responsible for pulling the Wisconsin river straight.

 

[chris_girard]

....uhmmm Chris , way to stay with the thread man. What did Gregg say ?

Sorry guys, been busy with work the last few days.

Greg says to hold the rope at a slight angle in front of the pigtail as you are lowering and there shouldn't be any issues. Also, as you are taking wraps, be sure to wrap squarely (perpendicular) to the winch.

It looks like my ground crew are following directions correctly, though I can't always tell from up high. I will setup a training day when we can lift pieces and let them run trying out different conditions.

 

[Chris E]

We've only experienced hockling so far when lowering heavy log sections with 3 or more wraps, we slowed the lowering speed and this rectified.