woodworkingboy
TreeHouser
Powerful saw with a sharp chain, a steady strong pull with a fast cut. Go for it.
No Face
- Thread starter MasterBlaster
- Start date
- Replies 94
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wiley_p
Climbing Up
Butch, was this guy from Alabama by chance? I threw several guys off of a project in LA for using that same technique with disastrous results. I was told thats how they "fall" timber in Alabama. I was always curious how the lead looked in their strips.
Bad idea all around.
Bad idea all around.
gf beranek
Old Schooler
In lopping brush and small trees I seldom use a face cut. Though I maintain cutting as long as the tree moves to keep it from splitting.
The technique you described, Butch, it sounds risky to me, but it just goes to show another mans method.
I'd like to have watched and recorded it. Like Kenny said the way fiber varies in different trees you may get by with it in some but certainly not all.
The technique you described, Butch, it sounds risky to me, but it just goes to show another mans method.
I'd like to have watched and recorded it. Like Kenny said the way fiber varies in different trees you may get by with it in some but certainly not all.
Al Smith
Mac Daddy
It doesn't sound too good to me but neither do those bore cut ,back cut deals they use on veneer trees either .They say it's done to prevent fiber pull . I guess not being a veneer cutter I just wouldn't know .
I use the binder chain when it doubt .As I have said before I had one chair on me early on and I've never forgotten it .
I use the binder chain when it doubt .As I have said before I had one chair on me early on and I've never forgotten it .
B
Bounce
Guest
When I was a kid, I was playing around with my new bow and shot an arrow straight up into the air. As soon as I did it I realized that the slightest little breeze could make that arrow go anywhere it pleased and that I might be about to die. Looks like this guy is as lucky as I am. The difference is that I never did it again, while this guy apparently did it 3 times in 1 day.
T
TGCIII
Guest
he said 3 times a day. come back to our world but i promise it's gonna hurt
Burnham
Woods walker
One thing we can remind ourselves of is the Coos Bay felling cut. Recall that Jerry Beranek describes it with no face, as opposed to my own variation of it. Here's a link to the thread where we hashed it out.
http://gypoclimber.com/showthread.php?t=9410
Now this fella is not doing the same thing, exactly. But there are similarities.
Nonetheless, I don't think it wise when it is possible to put in a proper face. There's where your directional control comes from...I only would go without if there was too much lean to allow it (and then I'd do the Coos Bay style), or in quite small wood...as others have said already.
It's lazy and probably gonna bite his azz one day.
http://gypoclimber.com/showthread.php?t=9410
Now this fella is not doing the same thing, exactly. But there are similarities.
Nonetheless, I don't think it wise when it is possible to put in a proper face. There's where your directional control comes from...I only would go without if there was too much lean to allow it (and then I'd do the Coos Bay style), or in quite small wood...as others have said already.
It's lazy and probably gonna bite his azz one day.
Burnham
Woods walker
Butch, when you say he used a chain to control the barberchair, do you mean he bound it, or he cut it fast?
MasterBlaster
Administrator Emeritus
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #59
He bound it.
Burnham
Woods walker
Gotcha...so barberchairing was not a big issue, but uncontrolled direction of fall still is.
If he can accelerate the skidder fast enough to keep ahead of the speed the tree falls, I reckon it could work out most of the time...but people usually don't keep going that fast that long.
If he can accelerate the skidder fast enough to keep ahead of the speed the tree falls, I reckon it could work out most of the time...but people usually don't keep going that fast that long.
MasterBlaster
Administrator Emeritus
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #61
I'm telling ya, all three pulled over just as pretty as you please.
Burnham
Woods walker
Poll is 27 to zero for using a face...I'd vote for using a face too, except for the occasional Coos Bay. Need one more option in the poll 
.
http://gypoclimber.com/showthread.php?t=9510
.http://gypoclimber.com/showthread.php?t=9510
wiley_p
Climbing Up
I've seen it work to a degree, but the guys that used that technique exclusively were off a bunch about 80% of the time. A coos bay works because there is a headlean, and it isn't a precision cut, just a safe option for dealing with heavy trees.
woodworkingboy
TreeHouser
If the tractor is strong enough to pull it over enough against the lean, to the point where the tree is leaning towards the lay, and with no slack in the line, unless there are issues with the limb weight making it go astray once it starts to fall, it seems OK to me. Still, a face would reduce how much the tractor needs to pull. No?
G
Gord
Guest
It's without a doubt a hack move, and you'd likely only get away with it on something like (some) pine or spruce etc. Try it on cottonwood or silver maple and they'd go sideways more often than not I would bet.
vl2007
Treehouser
Poll is 27 to zero for using a face...I'd vote for using a face too, except for the occasional Coos Bay. Need one more option in the poll
http://gypoclimber.com/showthread.php?t=9510
Have not yet had the opportunity to use the Coos Bay, but it's in my tool box.
sotc
Dormant hero!!
yes because it moves the fulcrum point further back. burnham makes a good point where when pulling a tree over it reaches a point quickly that the pull point moves faster than the thing pulling making it
gf beranek
Old Schooler
"Keeping ahead of the split."
You ever hear that before? I learned there is some degree of control if you can cut the stem faster than than it would split out. But once the split occurs you generally lose control.
It's specific only to falling small trees to their favor. With a little windage control in some. Even with limbs in the tree.
I never forget when Mike Davis described the Coo's Bay cut to me in a bar one night( the Golden West) and while he was telling me about the Coos Bay I thought he lost his mind. But I knew Mike was a Pro.
About a year later I had a strip of trees to cut on an old land slide near Dos Rios. The only trees left standing on that slide were all heavy leaners, Doug Fir. I was at a loss to figure a way to deal with those trees until I remembered what Mike told me. And before the day was over I had that strip cut and bucked without a single barber chair. Now I use the Coos Bay cut on heavy spars and limbs in the tree. It's unconventional, but it works.
I'll always use a face cut on a fair standing or back leaning trees to see them to the lay. Heavy head leaners, however ......
You ever hear that before? I learned there is some degree of control if you can cut the stem faster than than it would split out. But once the split occurs you generally lose control.
It's specific only to falling small trees to their favor. With a little windage control in some. Even with limbs in the tree.
I never forget when Mike Davis described the Coo's Bay cut to me in a bar one night( the Golden West) and while he was telling me about the Coos Bay I thought he lost his mind. But I knew Mike was a Pro.
About a year later I had a strip of trees to cut on an old land slide near Dos Rios. The only trees left standing on that slide were all heavy leaners, Doug Fir. I was at a loss to figure a way to deal with those trees until I remembered what Mike told me. And before the day was over I had that strip cut and bucked without a single barber chair. Now I use the Coos Bay cut on heavy spars and limbs in the tree. It's unconventional, but it works.
I'll always use a face cut on a fair standing or back leaning trees to see them to the lay. Heavy head leaners, however ......
woodworkingboy
TreeHouser
There is the speed of the pulling implement part, but it seems to me that with no face, the tree isn't going to want to lean towards the lay so readily, so the pull force translates to a lot of tension in the tree in the right direction, sort of a whipping action once it starts to go. Won't that make up a bit for a pull that can't keep up with the tree when it goes over? With that tractor you've got what....2 tons of pull maybe..that's a lot of force to get a pine to start going where you want it to.
It's a perfect barber chair scenario without the chains.
It's a perfect barber chair scenario without the chains.
sotc
Dormant hero!!
i think i see what your saying buut i dont think you could cut fast enough to use the whip. i think it would come over slowlytill the "stretch" was gone or gravity took over. kinda mind boggling to think about
sotc
Dormant hero!!
unless you bore cut and trip it. that sounds kinda scary though
rbtree
Climbing Up
- Joined
- Jun 22, 2005
- Messages
- 1,924
MasterBlaster
Administrator Emeritus
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #73
Who's Dave?
SkwerI
Treehouser
That would be wiley_p I believe. The folks at the saw shop call him 'nice guy Dave'. 
MasterBlaster
Administrator Emeritus
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #75
Ahhh, from 12 posts ago. Not confusing at all.
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