Advice on a simple set up

[woodworkingboy]

I had a crane operator that I know come out to do a job a few weeks ago, a friend of mine. He had never seen much in the way of rope tree climbing techniques, rather rare in these parts, and was very enthusiastic about them. He asked me to order some gear for him, nothing fancy, just to get him started on DdRT. I advised that I would purchase a saddle for him, some climbing line, hitch cord, and a pulley. On the rope and cord, i was thinking to get some Hy-Vee and some HRC or Beeline for his cord. It seems like a good default choice to me, but I don't have a lot of experience with this and that, so I would appreciate some thoughts on it. I also thought about possibly getting him going on a Tautline or Blake's hitch instead, but he has very good outdoor skills and already climbs trees in his own way, as well as doing some other dangerous outside activities that he enjoys and is wise about, so I thought that it might not be stretching things to start him out with a VT hitch, and explain the cautions as I know them. From there, i figure that he can progress on his own in whichever direction.

Thanks a lot for any advice, I definitely don't want to put the man at risk with my own lack of knowledge. There is no place around to get proper training, or i would prefer to advise that. Not wanting to go too deep into options either.

Jay

 

[MasterBlaster]

'Nuff said.

 

[pigwot]

Poison Ivy is a good all around rope and beeline or hrc is fine for his hitch. Start him off on a Michoacan, which is a hitch cord version of he Blake's hitch; grabs consistently without set-back if it is tied close to the pulley. As he gets comfotable woith the setup then introduce the VT. If he really takes to climbing suggest he get a HitchHiker; as long as he lets you borrow it...

 

[woodworkingboy]

Yes, I am thinking that too. He already saw the VT set up in action, and it is what got him excited. I don't think he has yet to see a Tautline, maybe I should just tell him that it is all he needs to get going?

 

[woodworkingboy]

Thanks Pat, I think good advice too. Maybe show him some options and see what he gravitates to, after he plays with it a bit himself.

 

[MasterBlaster]

I love my Fly.

http://www.wesspur.com/rope/fly-rope.html

 

[bonner1040]

I think a larger diameter cord, like 10mm Ocean Pacific, tied in a schwabish is a beginner friendly setup. The Schwabish is an easy to tie, very reliable grabbing hitch.

I also agree that New England's Fly, is a fantastic rope.

 

[NickfromWI]

For a beginner, I would start him off on a Blakes Hitch. The advanced hitches can be finicky and might fluster him when it doesn't grab right away.

My list would be

Rope, spliced
Split tail
2 biners
Lanyard with a yalex eye-eye cord and hitch climber

That lanyard is his intro to advanced hitches.

Definitely split tail of some sort, though...regardless of the fact that Butch posted his traditional climbing setup pic again. (that must be the most-posted picture on this website!)

love
nick

 

[MasterBlaster]

also agree that New England's Fly, is a fantastic rope.

But, I sure don't like the way it tends to grab stuff, or tie itself in a knot. You kinda gotta baby it, which I hated at first, but its pay-offs makes the extra trouble worth it.

 

[bonner1040]

Its so soft the tail will wrap around stuff easy thats for sure.

 

[NickfromWI]

I think I would go with a Poison Ivy sized line. And the Fly splice is butt-ugly.

 

[SouthSoundTree]

Teaching a Blake's or Tautline as a back-up to a dropped split tail, and for a secondary climbing system for double-tieing-in would be good, IMO. Split tail system with a simple, dependably grabbing hitch is good.



Can anybody post a picture of a Michoacan, please?

 

[NickfromWI]

It's a Blake's hitch tied with an eye-eye


love
nick

 

[woodworkingboy]

Thanks for the advice, I think that showing him the possibilities with more advanced hitches, but suggesting that he cut his teeth with a Blake's hitch, is a good way to go. As Sean suggested, having a Blake's hitch available to him if in need of a back-up, does add security.

Nick, why do you particularly recommend the Yalex cord? I'm unfamiliar with it, bit it looks similar to Tenex in photos.

 

[Adam_P]

I'm not sure what the availability is there but yale's imori is a sweet rope. 12mm, with a added fiber for texture that makes it really nice on the hands. Works great in drt or srt. I use it with armor prus for a hitch cord.

I put most people I'm first teaching on a 6 coil prussik and make them hump up natural crotch. A little suffering up front really makes them appreciate climbing on a friction saver with a foot ascender.

 

[Monkeywithasaw]

Why not new england hi-vee and and a 5 coil prussic simple some what fail proof and easy to learn.

 

[flushcut]

Why not start him on something cheaper like say trublue or arborplex, because what if dude doesn't like climbing or just doesn't have the skill. If you can climb on that crap anything else will be that much better.

 

[NickfromWI]

No way. If dude doesn't like climbing, you're stuck with a crappy rope. Heck- get him arborplex and that will be the reason WHY he doesn't like climbing.

Get him something half decent.


love
nick

 

[stig]

I start apprentices on a Distal, tied with tenex.
That stuff is so brabby, it works fine as a beginners set-up.
Once they get comfortable and I deem it safe, they go on to beeline and a VT.

Haven't lost one out of a tree yet.

 

[pigwot]

Teaching a Blake's or Tautline as a back-up to a dropped split tail, and for a secondary climbing system for double-tieing-in would be good, IMO. Split tail system with a simple, dependably grabbing hitch is good.

Can anybody post a picture of a Michoacan, please?

http://whizbark.com/~pgwhiz/Apr07-cc.pdf

 

[pete mctree]

Start at the beginning, the basics operate well & will be a good foundation ;

16 stand with a split tail & a blakes hitch. Screw the taughtline, poor performance.

Flipline with a grab of sorts - wirecore would be good if funds allow. Safer (if not working next to power lines)

3-way locking krabs are a must. Easy to operate & trusted function.

 

[bonner1040]

I couldn't imagine not starting with a Blake's for a professional. As a rec climber you want them to enjoy it. Start with something nicer then teach the Blake's when they are interested.

10mm OP schwabish

 

[Peter]

I tend to start people off with a short distel and hitch climber, then teach them a three knot system with a blakes hitch once they have got the hang of ascending on a short hitch.

Its important to be able to tie a blakes to get out of a jam. However climbers that learn on a blakes usually have trouble adapting to the different ascending technique of a short hitch. The short hitch system is better ergonomically and with the right friction hitch is 100% reliable, so why start off with an inferior system that leads to bad habits?

 

[bonner1040]

I agree, and again, most important for a rec climber is that they enjoy it!

Knowing the blakes is a given, because as Peter says you might need it to get out of a jam or just double crotch. Wait till they like it for all that.

Dont even bother teaching the knots at first. Like in rock climbing, when teaching newbies its best to just get them up in the air in a safe controlled environment set up by you, the expert. It will be obvious to you and them if they like it, and if they do, that interest tends to be intense so teaching them the fundamentals is easy after that.

 

[1BUS]

I'm with Peter and Nick everyone should know how to set up a closed system, for fun? I climbed on a closed system this morning figure eight on a bight with a blakes, hip thrust 40' or so to the first crotch, its alot of work not fun, and a hitch climber set up with quality gear and close guidance would be a better place to start.