What's Your Favorite Saw You Own?

[Frankie]

It is worthwhile to see how it was done back in the day. Some of the equipment is still working and probably continue to work long after I’ve left this mortal coil. Seems to me like the heyday of chainsaws was 80-90s with Husqvarna and STIHL leading the pack. You can still find good runners around though the pickings are getting slim . Not sure if the newer strato saws will have similar longevity. My gut feeling is no

 

[Magnus]

New strato saws are heavier, less grunt more rpm and more sencetive to airleaks as they have one from start.

 

[Frankie]

I think the weight of the newer versions may be slightly less depending on which saws you are talking about ... For example the STIHL 462c is considerably lighter than the 461 it replaces , about 1.5lb fully gas/oil pho ... It is more difficult to coax power out of the newer strato saws than the older versions but it can be achieved ! My personal 462c when stock , torque not plentiful down low - dogged in and pulling on up on pistol grip- didn’t take much to stop the chain ... Now, with k/n filter with outwears , machined aluminum intake , porting and tuned exhaust it cuts 27% faster and has torque galore everywhere! You are correct Magnus - the saws do have a “controlled air-leak” and demand fresh fuel and top tier mix oil

 

[lxskllr]

Is reduced weight due to impoved engineering/manufacturing tolerances, or is it inherent in the design?

 

[Frankie]

I think STIHL is trying to deliver a product that gives the customer the best cutting experience with the least weight yet still complies with epa regulations - the older saws did not have the epa constraints and were more straight - forward and “dirtier” , the new strato-saws inject raw air into the cylinder and run cleaner and one could say leaner ... The 462c is lightweight and powerful stock - it turns into an animal when modded - just make sure you run fresh fuel and the best mix you can get with these newer offerings ... just my 2c

 

[Magnus]

No, the older saws was not dirtier if you look on the environmental impact they had. Emissions is not effecting our environment nearly as much as production. Old saws in late 80's and 90's could easily be run 2500hrs runtime on an 254 as example. Today you need two or more 550's for same run time. Even worse if you don't if you don't run same fuel.

Fuel here in gas stations is donkey piss compared to earlier. Its aggressive and low properties. They keep blaming alcohol mixed in it, but thats not quite true. You can run saws on E85 if you know what you are doing. That's not the problem. Problem is all other crap they mix in the soup. We are lucky here and have Aspen fuel to run in our saws. Its a lot better for saw and that makes my life a lot easier.
I think 90 percent of users here use Aspen. The few who don't get to pay for their choices in repairs and new saws.

 

[Frankie]

Magnus , what I meant by dirtier was that more fresh mix went out the exhaust and the saws ran comparatively richer and cooler in comparison to the newer offerings ... The enemy of a 2-stroke is heat and the newer saws seem to run leaner and hotter than the older versions even with auto tune or mtronic ... The new saws also produce more hp stock than old versions for same cc right out of the box and in the case of 462c produce the juice at higher rpm with seemingly less bottom end than previous offerings ... I cannot claim this is true for every saw just what I’ve modded ... As far as total hours runtime I’ve never wore one out yet lol! I think the strato design will require only the best fuel/mix to get the best longevity due to its inherent design. I run the STIHL Motomix and my saws run strong and the cylinder and piston almost spotless after many many tanks ... As far as fuel from gas station I agree that it is subpar ... Where I live independent testing has shown 14-20% ethanol in pumps marked 10% ! Run that fuel in a modded saw and you are taking your chances ! Even pumps marked “non-ethanol” can legally contain 5% ethanol by law. I used to think the STIHL ultra was a dirty oil as at end of season when inspecting engine there would be quite a bit of carbon/accumulation on piston and cylinder head - When I switched to motomix I was pleasantly surprised with how CLEAN the engine was , Almost spotless and very nicely lubed! .... Now the STIHL ultra was used in both mixes .... motomix and pump gas , this proved to my satisfaction that it must be the GASOLINE ITSELF that was causing the buildup, after hours of research this proved to be the case ! Not sure if aspen and motomix are the same , I know motomix is an alkalayte fuel that’s 99.9% pure and the first “crack” off the refining process ... Another benefit is the operator isn’t breathing in all the toxins from pump gas !

 

[Magnus]

In a flushed two stroke there is a few things we can't do much about. One of those things is the expansion of ignited fuel/air mix.
Flame take a certain amount of time and for all to burn as it expands it needs time to do this.
Chances of it burning more is higher at 8000rpm than 18000rpm.
There are limits...

Its not the alcohol in the fuel that is the bad thing. You can run it on E85 if you find oil that mix well with it. It must be an esteric oil.

We have the worst fuel in Europe, Probably in the world here. I tested some of yours when I was there 2008 and it was like ours in 80's.

 

[lxskllr]

I've tested fuel for alcohol a few times. It's always come out right. The alcohol free, was, and the corn gas had the correct percentage.

 

[Tree09]

In the us they are pretty anal about the percentages. Having said that even i have switched to premix store bought fuel and already have less problems. I'm using trufuel. Yes it's multiples more expensive, but when I'm running it I'm making so much money i don't care, and down time is not worth it to me anymore. Saws are basically a race engine, if you cheap on fuel it will kill it.

 

[Magnus]

Well, even if they are anal about it, it does not help to know what is what, really.

There was a test here a few years ago were they ran saws on E85.
I know there is a couple experimental runner using it now too.
Hardest part is to find oil that mix well with it E85.

 

[Frankie]

You can run a saw on moonshine if you want - Hope you are an expert carburetor hand !

 

[Magnus]

You thing Alcohol is the bad thing? You are wrong.

 

[kevin bingham]

i cant use huskys because there is no dealer around anywhere. i dont know how husky people do it as i never see husky dealers anywhere.

 

[Frankie]

You thing Alcohol is the bad thing? You are wrong.

The trouble with 2-strokes and alcohol (Whether ethanol or methanol) is that it absorbs water and the mix oil no likey water ! In fact phase separation can occur and your engine could quite possibly starve for lubrication / be inadequately lubricated ... You also need considerably More fuel than gasoline or aspen and it can make the engine run hotter which is not good for a work saw. In the case of methanol you must drain the fuel after using the saw and run fresh gas/aspen mix thru the engine otherwise it’s corrosive properties can do a number on the saws’ components and in the cases of methanol it is not conducive to health if you get my drift ... I’d steer clear of running ethanol or methanol fuel in a worksaw... your mileage may vary

 

[lxskllr]

I have one Husky dealer I know of, and I can walk to them from work, but if not for them, I couldn't say where I could pick one up. Stihl easily dominates around here, and echo makes a pretty good showing. All the other also-rans? Never seen one at all aside from box stores(Makita).

 

[Magnus]

The trouble with 2-strokes and alcohol (Whether ethanol or methanol) is that it absorbs water and the mix oil no likey water ! In fact phase separation can occur and your engine could quite possibly starve for lubrication / be inadequately lubricated ... You also need considerably More fuel than gasoline or aspen and it can make the engine run hotter which is not good for a work saw. In the case of methanol you must drain the fuel after using the saw and run fresh gas/aspen mix thru the engine otherwise it’s corrosive properties can do a number on the saws’ components and in the cases of methanol it is not conducive to health if you get my drift ... I’d steer clear of running ethanol or methanol fuel in a worksaw... your mileage may vary

Actually when you try E85 they run cooler. Hard part of this is to find oil that mix well.
As you say all gas more or less has ethanol were you are I think I would try. So you have same issues either way (corrosion, water etc).

Here its not easy to find E85 anymore as it was not such a great idea, or cheap..

I follow some that do run E85 in saws and clearing saws. I find it very interesting to see how they turn out.
If you try this, make sure saw is carbon and crap free in cylinder, piston and case. If not it will be soon and the burned crap will give issues.

 

[Magnus]

You don't have Husqvarna/Stihl saws in box stores?

 

[lxskllr]

Not Stihl, though they do have some "cut down" "dealers" that have some consumer stuff amongst the hardware. Big box stores sell some Husky stuff, but I don't know about pro saws, and good luck finding decent supplies for the saws, much less intelligent advice.

 

[Magnus]

Well today its not so much about running a product an long time, its more buy and toss ideas that rule any way.
Buy several saws on internet, save 50 bucks/saw and throw it away when it brakes. No need for dealers shops and increased sales of new products.
It the modern way!

 

[lxskllr]

Unfortunately, I think you're right :^/

 

[Magnus]

If they complained about bad dealers 10 years ago, they will not be happy ten years from now with no dealers...

Today the hardest part in buying is not were to find it but the choice of product and the stuff for it. What product that works best...
No internet shop or dealer page will tell you that...

 

[Frankie]

Actually when you try E85 they run cooler. Hard part of this is to find oil that mix well.
As you say all gas more or less has ethanol were you are I think I would try. So you have same issues either way (corrosion, water etc).

Here its not easy to find E85 anymore as it was not such a great idea, or cheap..

I follow some that do run E85 in saws and clearing saws. I find it very interesting to see how they turn out.
If you try this, make sure saw is carbon and crap free in cylinder, piston and case. If not it will be soon and the burned crap will give issues.

I will just stick with the alkylate fuel. While more expensive it works for my application. One word of caution ; if you’ve used nothing but pump gas for a long time make sure to decarbonize the engine before switching to the Motomix , otherwise it will “clean” the engine for you at 10000rpm

 

[Magnus]

It is not the fuel that do this, its the oil in the fuel. Its an penetrating oil thar gets in under and as it gets loose burns and hopefully get out. If not it turns in to stone hard marbles that shake about in engine and eventually find their way in between piston and cylinder. Then it's nighty nite...

 

[Frankie]

Magnus , I cannot speak to the fuel you have in Sweden so take this for what it is worth ... Over here in NY using pump fuel will cause carbon deposits on the piston crown and on the cylinder / squish band and exhaust port even with excellent tune ! Years ago I ran pump gas 91oct no ethanol mixed with STIHL ultra - An area near me was being developed and I bought the logs (real nice shagbark hickory) - Put at least 100hrs on that saw over the spring and fall and during winter tore down and it was coated with carbon (tune was spot on so not rich or lean k) ... At that time I believed it was the STIHL ultra oil that was causing this build up - I discovered thru experience nothing could be further than the truth ! I purchased a new 441cm and ran exclusively on Motomix - after 100 hours clean as a whistle and well lubed ! Piston wash from transfers only - NO carbon on exhaust port , squish band or piston besides the piston wash ... saw ran on Pump gas and STIHL ultra = carbon spooge ... saw ran on alkylate fuel and STIHL ultra = clean as a whistle with piston wash ... If a guy has been running pump gas for a long time and wants to switch to motomix I advise to tear down and decarbon the engine before making the switch otherwise the motomix WILL decarbon the engine for you and at 10000rpm in cut should those “stone hard marbles” dislodge it could be good nite Irene for the engine ... Pick 1 (pump gas / mix or motomix or other canned fuel) and stick with it is my advice ! STIHL ran a test of 500hrs of continuous operation on a trimmer with motomix and various other fuels/mixes - the results speak for themselves... If I can find I will post the data