Tree Removal -- My 1st Removal for Pay -- $500

[rfwoody]

===========================
= This was my first tree removal for pay. =
===========================

* Total of 4 days work
* Approx 22 hours of work (not including 40 min drive time each way)
* Paid $500

* Did most of work with a 21' pole saw.
* Some pole saw work from ground
* Some from stepladder in pickup truck bed.

* This was my first use of rigging down limbs

MISTAKES:

* Sawing while standing on stepladder from truck bed (I have since learned this is an unsafe practice)
* Rigged one big limb the wrong way, but thankfully no damage to anything.
* Broke driver's side mirror on my truck with (another) falling limb
* (also see below)

SUCCESSES:

* Had a couple of good rigging setups for lowering limbs which I was proud of.
* The house was surrounded with obstacles/hazards and thankfully I didn't break anything (of homeowner's).

LEARNED:

* Limbs are bigger and heavier than they look from the ground
* Limbs are higher up than they look from the ground
* If using a ladder, need to tie in securely with climbing gear

STILL TO DO:

* Buy climbing gear -- even for "low" branches -- vs. using ladder without being tied in.
* Get some white rattle cans and spray truck to make it look more professional.
* Get magnetic signs for truck doors.

Here is the (good?) ... the BAD and the UGLY:


Photo taken September 25 when lots of leaves and flowers.



DAY 1 -- Nov 2, 2017 -- Begin work
-- over halfway through the day.



Day 2 -- Nov 14, 2017
(about 2 weeks later... after my pole saw arrived)
--- I am proud of my rigging



Day 2
-- End of day



Day 3 -- Nov 15, 2017
-- climbed extension ladder to tie rigging



Day 3
-- The one time(?) I knowingly violated the little safety voice in my head...
I had one foot on 3rd rung of step ladder and one foot on roof of truck, cutting with chainsaw at shoulder height in order to cut most of the big limb I was rigging before finishing the cut with the pole saw.
All I can say is I spent a lot of time thinking about it and making sure I had solid footing. ---
I must never do this again.



Day 3
-- You can see the abovementioned cut through the tree about half way down.



Day 3
-- finished cut with pole saw and rigged down the piece.



Day 3
-- About ready to start cleaning up for the day



Day 3
-- Cleaned up and ready to leave.



Day 4 -- Nov 16, 2017
-- ready to cut remaining trunk and finish job



Day 4
-- Cleaned up, ready to leave job finished



Day 4
-- Done.


Any comments, criticism, remarks, advice, criticism, laughter, etc. are MUCH appreciated!

THANK YOU!

 

[SeanKroll]

Brush can make a great crash pad rather than rigging.


Extension ladders are most stable when you're at the bottom, least stable when you up top. Easy enough to have a belay rope while climbing the tree.



Much better to stand on the cab of the truck than ladder and cab, IMO. Better not to stand on the truck.



Stripping the ivy to check for defects can be useful, and help avoid frustration from a CF.

 

[Grendel]

Keep working to improve your execution, we all started somewhere. Ladders are terribly unsafe in most instances, tree work especially.

Cheers,

 

[SeanKroll]

Do you know ways to measure trees? Just have to get it small enough to fit.

 

[rfwoody]

Brush can make a great crash pad rather than rigging.


Extension ladders are most stable when you're at the bottom, least stable when you up top. Easy enough to have a belay rope while climbing the tree.



Much better to stand on the cab of the truck than ladder and cab, IMO. Better not to stand on the truck.



Stripping the ivy to check for defects can be useful, and help avoid frustration from a CF.

Sean, what is "CF" ?

Yeah, as for rigging, I was worried about all the obstacles/hazards all around.

Yeah, strange.... from an arborists point of view, this tree turned out to be good and solid most of the way up..... however something had caused many of the branches to die.

Yeah, I think I'm going to order the climbing gear today or tomorrow with Treestuff's 17% discount.

Thanks.

 

[rfwoody]

Keep working to improve your execution, we all started somewhere. Ladders are terribly unsafe in most instances, tree work especially.

Cheers,

Thanks a lot Sam!

 

[BlackSmith]

CF=Catastrophic Failure I think

 

[rfwoody]

Do you know ways to measure trees? Just have to get it small enough to fit.

I have used the "stick trick", holding a stick at 90 degree angle to make a right triangle, but I need to fine tune my technique on it... I'm doing something wrong I think.

Yes, absolutely about getting it small enough to fit! I could have felled it at 10 or 12 feet and it would have fit easily..... but I was being extra cautious about hitting any of the obstacles and just in case there was rot (e.g.) in the hinge and it didn't fall right..... and especially since it was my first removal job for pay... but yes, I hear you loud and clear on that.

 

[rfwoody]

CF=Catastrophic Failure I think

Got it! Thanks Bob!

 

[Merle Nelson]

Great clean up job. That will get you more recommendations than you can imagine in my area.

You're now a professional (does something for pay.) Keep the just before and final clean up pictures handy, for a lot of people wanting a removal, that is all they will need to see to say, yeah do it.

 

[Merle Nelson]

Congratulations.

 

[Merle Nelson]

By the way, if you were near me there are jobs I don't care to do that I would be inclined to hand of to a respectful person that finishes what he starts, like yourself. People that really can't or shouldn't be affording my prices, small partial day jobs, modest amounts of brush I don't care to run through my chipper, and etc.

Wonder who in your area would feel roughly the same and or be a good part time mentor to you?

 

[CurSedVoyce]

Off to a start.
The best thing you can do for yourself now (and you are in a way) is always ask your self, was there a better and safer way I could have done this job. Learn from asking that question and do research. Learn. Impliment onto next job. Efficiency and better pay will come as you develop the skills.
Second.
Just remember, every time you use a ladder or the bed of your truck for cutting; chances are, there will be a professional tree company rep with a phone, with a camera, possibly taking pictures or video to be posted on a FB or Forum such as this. Calling you unprofessional, or hack, or making fun of you at your expense. A good deterrent.
Third,
Constructive criticism from members of this forum prodded by your posts is a learning opportunity. Search out some of my old posts, you'll get a good laugh. I know some of these fellas did...


Carry on

 

[gf beranek]

Great documentation. and clean finish. A few wisdom's and new tools can improve the hourly rate much.

 

[SkwerI]

A typical example of somebody cutting a tree from a ladder.

 

[MasterBlaster]

He was just showing off with that fancy dismount!

 

[Bermy]

Well done for doing it to the finish and documenting it.
Looks like you have done some sensible self-reflection and come out with a better way to execute things. I'm very sure that many of us were cringing when you said 'off a ladder in the bed of the truck'!! Its always good when you realize that you either don't have the right gear, or enough experience and make a plan to rectify that!
Time, and hanging out here will see you get better and better.

 

[theTreeSpyder]

Day 2 -- Nov 14, 2017

i'd say depending on it's disposition, this could have pulled open etc.?
Lots of back pressure into hinge as a ball/socket with this rope angle; instead of situation of not enough pre-tighten; this can self pre-tighten too much, whereby relief of tension /steam is necessary or can came back at climber hard; this almost killed me when distracted groundie didn't relieve tension as i screamed to..
.
Generally would have (moving down branch from saw) cut/leveraged length/Half Hitch/Running Bowline etc. as final hitch/Center of gravity/rest of log.
.
i assume the center of gravity is outside the roped region
.
The pressure on twists ; seems to have kept lacing on branch.
Generally want preceding Half Hitch to pull close, then further DOWN branch have final anchoring knot.
>>hitch alone gives single grab; resistance to Standing Part pull is more angle leveraged against line
>>Preceding with Half Hitch puts gives double grab and Standing Part resistor INLINE to the pull, then feeds to final anchoring knot.
single knot generally wants to pull across 90degrees to spar, special thing to pull inline down the column length/long axis on load
>>or rope as our climbing hitches do
.
so after cut and when branch hanging VERTICAL (unless balanced/ballast against self ):
ABoK chapter_22:Lengthwise Pull (pre-ramble/opening statement):
"To withstand a lengthwise pull without slipping is about the most that can be asked of a hitch. Great care must be exercised in tying the following series of knots, and the impossible must not he expected..."
>>rig worked,but not as positive mechanic of rope lock on branch for my tastes.
.
On the anchoring /final knot (against force flow thru line) seems a Running Bowline:
i'd prefer this mechanic too , to pull close , not open, and really to be topside/not around side
>>if anything pulling fromother side some to once again lock at end of eye/not pulling into open area of eye?
>>and to be further downstream , with a Half Hitch preceding it/not back towards saw.
.
Length between cut and 1st hitch to branch can be a support lever; plenty given here.
>>rig would not have worked near as well/if at all; if knots reversed in position ;
>>would have same first grab point,maybe less length but run final knot towards other end of log/not towards cut, perhaps dogging final Bowline/Clove at branching; but i like to keep Center of Gravity outside of this range too.


Not Sure no how cut is faced; but i think i'd offer downwards towards reader as path of least resistance to roll forward into;
>>especially with the leveraged rope tension giving a lot of float; looking at rope angle of pullback towards sawyer as a spice, sprinkled in very lightly; too much and can take sawyer out pretty hard.
.
i really,really do like how you rigged this first after clearing the way YET saving any potential critical offside rigging positions ~AND~ the offside ballast rather than throwing them away just to look like doing something!

 

[rfwoody]

Great clean up job. That will get you more recommendations than you can imagine in my area.

You're now a professional (does something for pay.) Keep the just before and final clean up pictures handy, for a lot of people wanting a removal, that is all they will need to see to say, yeah do it.

Thanks a lot, Merle!

 

[rfwoody]

Congratulations.

By the way, if you were near me there are jobs I don't care to do that I would be inclined to hand of to a respectful person that finishes what he starts, like yourself. People that really can't or shouldn't be affording my prices, small partial day jobs, modest amounts of brush I don't care to run through my chipper, and etc.

Wonder who in your area would feel roughly the same and or be a good part time mentor to you?

Thanks a lot, Merle! I really appreciate the encouragement and ideas!
That will be in the back of my mind.

Now I plan to spend the next few days "regrouping", reflecting, and ruminating on the job and everyone's feedback on this, the pole saw, etc.

 

[rfwoody]

Off to a start.
The best thing you can do for yourself now (and you are in a way) is always ask your self, was there a better and safer way I could have done this job. Learn from asking that question and do research. Learn. Impliment onto next job. Efficiency and better pay will come as you develop the skills.
Second.
Just remember, every time you use a ladder or the bed of your truck for cutting; chances are, there will be a professional tree company rep with a phone, with a camera, possibly taking pictures or video to be posted on a FB or Forum such as this. Calling you unprofessional, or hack, or making fun of you at your expense. A good deterrent.
Third,
Constructive criticism from members of this forum prodded by your posts is a learning opportunity. Search out some of my old posts, you'll get a good laugh. I know some of these fellas did...


Carry on

Thanks a lot for the good words and good advice!!!
I intend to reflect on this job over the next few days and do just that.

 

[rfwoody]

Great documentation. and clean finish. A few wisdom's and new tools can improve the hourly rate much.

Thanks a lot, Mr. Beranek!

Reviewing your book and DVD's while reflecting on this job is on my list to do the next few days.... even though at my age I'm not as concerned about the hourly rate as I am getting the job and working safely!

 

[rfwoody]

A typical example of somebody cutting a tree from a ladder.

yes.... one of those "youtube disaster videos" .... (I won't put a smiley face on it.)

Yes, believe it or not, these videos showing people cutting from ladders like this made an impression (e.g. the limb (or trunk) swinging back and taking out the extension ladder and the guy on the ladder) .... "so you went ahead and cut from a ladder anyway from the bed of your pickup?!" ... yeah, but I was always on the lookout and ready for and looked to avoid that very thing of the branch swinging back like that. (but on my picture with the extension ladder against the tree, in my defense, I was not cutting, as I recall, I was rigging). ..... and y'all have scared me enough I think that I won't do it again.

 

[rfwoody]

He was just showing off with that fancy dismount!

Butch, that is a funny quip, and y'all "battle hardened" veterans (if I may use that term without diminishing in the least my respect of those who have faced combat in the armed services) I'm sure have a different way of looking at it than me..... so I will just look at it and fear.

 

[rfwoody]

Well done for doing it to the finish and documenting it.
Looks like you have done some sensible self-reflection and come out with a better way to execute things. I'm very sure that many of us were cringing when you said 'off a ladder in the bed of the truck'!! Its always good when you realize that you either don't have the right gear, or enough experience and make a plan to rectify that!
Time, and hanging out here will see you get better and better.

Thanks a lot, Bermy!