SRT base tie question

[bstewert]

Normally, for an SRT base tie, I pull my rope up over the branch and tie that "short" end to the trunk. Then I climb the "long" end, most of which is still left in the bag.

For some reason today, after pulling up the rope and seeing the path around a few branches, I decided I'd rather climb the "short" end. I could just pull all the rope through to get to the other end. But say it was a 50' climb and you had 300' of rope in the bag. How would you tie the "long" end together at the bottom?

I'm not wild about the biner. The delta seems plenty strong enough, but how would you do it with just rope?

 

[simplypete]

I will usually take a wrap or two around the trunk. Then capture a biner with a clove and then clip the rope heading up into the canopy.

 

[MasterBlaster]

The biner shouldn't be a problem.

 

[SkwerI]

If you don't want to use a biner then take a wrap or two on the trunk, then take a bight of the rope and capture the leg going up into the canopy with a doubled running bowline.

 

[flushcut]

A fig 8 or a porty. In case you need to be lowered to the ground by a groundie. I like having that piece of mind.

 

[High Scale]

You could use two biners back to back?

 

[bstewert]

OK, a few ideas to try. Thanks. Not that it comes up every day.

I thought having a biner close to the trunk was frowned upon due to gate issues. In that case, this should be no problem, yes?

 

[sotc]

Yes except I would do a round turn. I really don't like the first pic, if you tree tapers, one small slip and whats to stop that rope from flying up to the first branch? Where would you end up? Maybe take a short piece of line as a rigging sling to go around the base and tie off to a rescue 8, climb the short end and you can be belayed out of the tree if need be. All you would have to invest in is an 8, you could cut 20' off the end of one of your ropes for the sling

 

[wiley_p]

It's fine, though I prefer to have the gate opposite the way you have. There is popular misconception that the carabiner is being side loaded. It's not, the friction of the rope around the stem takes up much of the force being imparted to the biner. Also, at worst there is a nominal amount of triaxial loading, but it is very little if at all.

A common tie off in high angle anchor systems is a Tensionless hitch. 6 wraps around the trunk and clip the biner bag on the standing end, there is no pressure on the biner at all.

 

[sotc]

What I don't like about the first system is there is a fixed length loop that depends on the little friction against the back of the tree for the most part. A little bouncing, loose bark, brush dragging etc and it could slip easily with no way to grab again. At least on the green rope it is a running system and can seize against the tree.

 

[stig]

I use a steel carabiner and take an extra wrap around the tree.

Paranoia, probably.

 

[pigwot]

I also use the second wrap, and a steel screw-link (delta or oval).
The second wrap helps avoid loosening when I am off rope on a branch and the system is slackened.

 

[bstewert]

I could just cut the long end of the rope to make it the right size.

 

[bstewert]

JUST KIDDING!!!!!

Willie, I do have a dead-eye sling to rig off of. I'm only posing this question to see what other guys are doing, and of course, to improve/streamline my systems. Plus, to know what would work if I didn't have a sling, or biner, or delta.

 

[PCTREE]

I second Brians post, just tie a running bowline with a doubled up piece of the long end/ middle. Make sense, we do it all the time with the Wraptor rope.

 

[Burnham]

Tensionless hitch, per Dave's post, is good...though I don't agree that you need 6 wraps, 3 is plenty enough in my opinion.

I like a double wrapped sling, binered to a hard-locked rappel rack, myself. Instead of the sling, you can use a spare lanyard.

If you don't want to use a rack, rescue 8, or porty, just tie a doubled figure eight or bowline wherever you want on the ascent line and clip both lanyard attacments onto that loop.

 

[wiley_p]

I don't think you need 6 either Burnham I was just giving the textbook answer. I think once around the trunk clipped on is just fine. Though I am a fan of running the system through a belay so the climber can be lowered in a situation, instead of terminating on the trunk like that. Folks just need to keep in mind you need 3x the rope to have the rescue built in.

 

[MasterBlaster]

Does anyone tie their timber hitch 7 times? I do 4, maybe 5 if I'm feeling paranoid.

 

[Bounce]

I like to use a figure 8, which is attached to the trunk with a nylon webbing sling. I think it's easier to install the rope midline in a figure 8 than to tie a midline running bowline, plus if it's already set up with some kind of belay device then somebody can lower you to the ground more quickly in case you get hurt.

The sideloading issue of the carabiner would only be a danger on small diameter trunks.

I've seen a timber hitch with 5 tucks come undone, but that might have been because they weren't spaced out around the trunk properly. I dunno for sure. Ever since though, I always do at least 6. It only takes a few extra seconds.

 

[SkwerI]

I'm gonna disagree with Nice Guy Dave on the carabiner position. I think the picture above in post #7 shows the correct orientation with the load on the spine. Facing the gate toward the trunk is not as good, it places the load on the gate side. Not to mention that rubbing on the trunk could possibly open the carabiner, depending on the style. I've been improperly loading carabiners for several years now in my rigging and I've had some open up on me due to having the load on the gate.

 

[sotc]

I don't have a problem with biners as shown, i'm amazed no one else has a problem with the basket configuration of the "sling"

 

[SkwerI]

I agree completely, Willie. At least another wrap, I don't like the fast taper of that trunk at all.

 

[Burnham]

Me too, Willie. Absolutely, on that trunk.

 

[sotc]

OK, i'm not insane then

 

[Burnham]

Didn't say that, as I recall .