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Rope

theTreeSpyder

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Rope is such a magical tool; to do all it does to pull and support, then fold up at the end of the day like it was nothing!
All at once, it is so simple it is complicated.
Things that look the same; are different because of the way they are lined up and how the force flows thru them.
Like watching 2 men work that appear to be doing the same thing; with different outcomes.
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spec_nip_vs_crossedTurn.png
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"Nature to be commanded, must be obeyed" - sir Francis Bacon
 

theTreeSpyder

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  • #8
Hey, ya'll!
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Nip is bite i guess, but then there is bight, so i say 'pinch'.
Big point is on a simple/single Turn, Nip is best opposite the pull on the spar;
where the rope pulls into the spar, not away.
This is partially what BabyHoldingBus was about.
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So, pic of same lacing, shows greater force on lesser is nip ;
Lesser force on greater is just a crossing.
But looks like same in knot tying sense.
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Lots of knot books and links, but still ABoK is the best.
Not just because the oldest or most comprehensive lists of knots.
If you read it rite; there are many lessons.
He says something 1 time and if you blink(easy to do during 600+ pages), you miss it!

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i think tree guys should read like Chapters_20-25 to pick 30 pages in a row most applicable(others apply, but as a start..)
i'd say the 30 pages is approximately 1/20th of the massive book.
And recommend you could get more out of reading those 30 pages,
10x, than the whole book 1x.
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Real deal is chapter_21 as right angles of pull/correct angle of pull; vs. column pulls in chapter_22(which goes into friction hitches).
in chap_21 you can tie the first few knots, trying to go thru them and go on; and miss a lot.
The side notes are the real lessons, the presented knots just the present examples of those lessons.
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"a round turn on the standing part adds materially to the strength of the knot" ; how a half hitch low nip gets skull cross-bonz and high nip gets anchor reliability, "To withstand a lengthwise pull without slipping is about the most that can be asked of a hitch. Great care must be exercised in tying the following series of knots, and the impossible must not he expected...." these things go for all knots and their inspections every day.
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download ABoK
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The 1st and last knots below are pictured together at the start of chap_21; we see a lot of low nippers, that Ashley rates as dangerous.
Once again the lesson isn't tying the 1st 2 knots, it starts a whole chapter of knots with half hitch as basis, and shows a flaw and cure for many before going on to those that inherit the same characteristics.

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fam_halfs.png
 

theTreeSpyder

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  • #9
Inversion ends up with pulley hanging from a Bowline, like it would in a choked sling.
Pull on Bowline eye should be down, but this can have across eye pulls/offset 90degrees from normal.
Bowline jacked 90degrees to side, to compensate and lock properly.
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theTreeSpyder

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This saved lots of work on removals.
Locking a climbing line high in tree when no branches for the running bowline to sit on.
This is real strong on tall palms.
Other trees might have branches, but only higher in weak/damaged part of tree you don't want to pull from.

throwline_no_branches.png
 

cory

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That is a sneaky trick, never have seen that, cool!!

And thanks for my treelessons.com, it is an excellent resource.
 

theTreeSpyder

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  • #14
TY,
In 1990, this all started on a "BBS" for ISA; we didn't call this a forum then, it would've been a Bulletin Board Service;
a post was like a message on a bulletin board.
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Dave Spencer of Canada made this to show speedlining with slings when we were trying to describe to others.
Rope is a fascinating tool, that does big work and then folds up into nothing!
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SouthSoundTree-

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Sep 24, 2014
Messages
4,941
TY,
In 1990, this all started on a "BBS" for ISA; we didn't call this a forum then, it would've been a Bulletin Board Service;
a post was like a message on a bulletin board.
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Dave Spencer of Canada made this to show speedlining with slings when we were trying to describe to others.
Rope is a fascinating tool, that does big work and then folds up into nothing!
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Interesting how the first negative-blocked spar chunk has two connections. Why?
 

theTreeSpyder

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  • #18
Also, less sharp line deformity/load spread more evenly............ as far as carrying part.
And the smaller branches easier and lighter to get near balance point easier, compared to dead drop/inversion of load/catch that needs butt tied.
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BUT, watch how the rope is tightened for the last drop(blue arrow) during hinging to muscle over last piece from the higher leverage sling/krab point, to drop into line softer. Spread krabs allow flat softer deformity carry, but also one krab can then be extremely high and used as pull point also. That is still a lot of force to hit horiz support line with IMO, but is just an illustration etc. and doable on some scales; preferably w/o me clinging to unsprung tree as line takes the hit.
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i've used similar also to turn limb with ~2/1 on hinge; as 2/1 flattened to be then the speedline; but same strategy of using 1 krab point as a pull point to force hinge thicker and steer(turn) and then be part of a speedline .
early attempt at animation 90's-ish: 2 to 1 speedline.gif
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As far as carrying flat, sometimes i'd preset running Bowlines on ends of targets from ground;
climb and rig out but end as truck or winch pulling pre-set rope from other side of street, maybe even 10' up(like low pulley then too so no upward pull on truck/traction loss).
Worked very nicely form backyard, fairly flat nose and tail of limb stretched between lowering and pulling lines over house, fence, front yard, oversteering to opposite side of street, but landing on cx side of street much easier to work and less line loading by oversteering and then slopping to drop early/on actual target. early flash :cradle rig.swf

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If not enough run for truck to pull line, put line thru pulley across street, then instead of terminate pull at truck put pulley on truck with same line thru it back to anchor. Truck would pull 1/2 as much force 2x as fast/2x distance. so if had 100' truck run, could pull 200' from back to front.
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i guess we never had Men Working signs; it was easy to see we was bustin'butt !
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All methods, less carrying, less sawing and cleanup in backyard and put on a show that can attract sale$.
 

theTreeSpyder

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  • #19
i mentioned pulling 2x as far/fast as truck for dragging and '2piece speedline' (lower w/1 line and pull with other so load travel horiz over roof etc.).
i came up with this rig on a 120' drag uphill that riding mowers etc. couldn't get up in a 100degree Florida Sun.
Guys were calling it 'Hell Hill' after a few drags, Doc's driveway was curved, the best we could do was a 60' pull w/truck.




sled_fast.png
 

theTreeSpyder

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  • #21
This is kinda like speedline in that 90% clean up and delivery at road.
(guys called it 2 piece speedline so i named to 2pc. drift line)
Rig point was about 60' up in tree, then 10' for high pulley.

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1 day drove 1.5hr$ (paying 3 guys) to remove 6 branches.
Customer had built fence around backyard, planted pretties under target etc. after quoted.
Customer presented with choice of pay guys 3hrs travel out of pocket or make job werk.
(ol'man wouldn't pay a dime more)
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Necessity can be a real mother, birthing many things;
somewhere between the eclipse of can and can't,
we sometimes find very powerful things!
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We finished the job in half the time!
And added this to our trick bag;
3 more job$ walked up to us that day; did one of them that day!
(ol'man actually then thought should get discount cuz didn't take all day like quoted and got other job!!!)
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theTreeSpyder

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Feb 12, 2016
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  • #22
A good friend called 'Parbuckle' is a rope machine, often listed as a knot.
Olde ships would have a ramp to roll up barrels;
they'd anchor 1 end of line at top of ramp, line travels down ramp,
then around/over barrel and back to top of ramp to be pulled.
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This gives a 2/1 over a rolling load uphill.
The barrel kinda forms it's own pulley to pull itself so;
but even better, for a pulley would drag load,
but a parbuckle also WALKS ITSELF/ doesn't drag load like pulley fixed to load would!
You can't cheat Mother Nature at Her own game;
but you can surrrrrrre join Her in said game / already in progress!!
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Flat ground application
(after cutting tree down with hand tools/ no chainsaws, they were probably a little too tired to drag this small piece):
parbuckle_flat.jpg
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more on LINK: loading logs on trailer with parbuckle and winch
 
L

Levi

Guest
Good stuff, thanks for sharing. Setting the running bowline with a throwline looks very handy!
 
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