The Tree House loves TreeStuff!

Mycor

F

Frans

Guest
I would like to know if it is true that ALL plants require the presence of Mycor in order to live.

Is this statement true? or false?

:?
 

Stumper

Treehouser
Joined
Mar 6, 2005
Messages
3,392
Location
Colorado
Whether you would like to know about myc or not is something I can only guess at but since you are generally honest and forthright I assume that is TRUE.
As for mycorhizal fungi being imperative for the grtowth of all plants-FALSE.
 

treelooker

Treehouser
Joined
Jul 24, 2005
Messages
1,013
Location
NC
False, of course, even for trees. Do they do better with mycorrhizae, usually, sometimes dramatically.
 

rumination

Migratory Hippie Arbolist
Joined
Mar 6, 2005
Messages
3,285
Location
Hong Kong
Not true Frans. For instance, consider hydroponically grown plants. They grow quite well even though their roots are in a medium which does not harbor mycorrhizae. Another example would be nurseries that grow plants in sterile growth mediums so that they may receive phytosanitary certificates to be shipped across borders.

I would guess, though, that in the natural environment most plants benefit from a relationship with mycorrhizae. That's just a guess, though.
 

NickfromWI

King of Splices
Joined
Mar 30, 2005
Messages
4,994
Location
Snowless California
Mycorrhizal fungus forms a mutualistic symbiotic relationship between the tree roots and the fungus. The fungus increases surface area of the roots and increases the trees uptake of water (and thus, nutrients). In exchange, the fungus recieves sugar/glucose/starches from the roots.

Neither hurts the other, but niether is reliant on the other. The roots can survice without the fungus, and the fungus without the roots.

I help plant hundreds and thousands of trees per year and almost every one of them gets mycorrhizal fungus (in dry/powder form) at planting. I'm not sure yet how to know if it is actually doing what it is supposed to be doing.

love
nick
 

TC3

Headache !
Joined
Aug 12, 2006
Messages
1,505
Location
Michigan
I feel frustrated about an argument that asks, "Is nature the right way ?"
We will all feel the repurcussions of not following Nature. Like a slap on the wrist ? Like our grandkids will have to filter every drop of water they want to injest ? Like who-the-f**k-cares-because-I paid-my-friggin'-dues ?
Follow even a little bit. Who the hell cares if the factory down the road produces more waste than you & your family in a hundred years ? Who the f**k cares ? Honest to Crikey, just do what you can.
I'm doing what I can.
I believe that the introduction of Mycorrhizae fungus into urban soil(s) makes a difference.
 
F

Frans

Guest
Yes I have read the articles and spoken with Mike from this company and bought products from them.

"95% of all known tree species have mycor. present" is a quote from one of the articles.

Still, my understanding is that a mature tree cannot reach maturity or even grow, without mycor.
Ergo, every tree we come across in our work, has mycor. present.

I would like to know if this statement is true.
 

TC3

Headache !
Joined
Aug 12, 2006
Messages
1,505
Location
Michigan
Thanks, Nick. You brought up a great point ... truly.
BELIEF.
Myco is not about belief. It is not about faith. It is not about hope.
It is about FACT.
When you manipulate urban environments to the extent that NATURE has to be re-introduced, do not tuck tail & run. Own it.
Call it 'snake oil' ??? Are you kidding me ??? Leaf drop / compost becomes voodoo. Soil amendments become the stuff of witchdoctors. Is that what you're reducing us to ?????????????????????????????
 
W

wiltingoak

Guest
It's true.

What's a problem is that the market people aren't understanding of how species-specific certain strains of their products are and are represented as the cure-all and applications encouraged to all trees, regardless of family bet it Beech or Pine.

Here's a neat trick:
propagate from seed a hickory (or a walnut, etc.) and grow it in the lab, sans any soil and even sterilize the growing media. Hydroponics for development and growth.

Now in a year, observe the root hairs.

Wonder where they came from?

Innoculating a pecan for example, it's an oldschool tool to speed development of growth as the native micor balance populations fluctuate in extremes due to conditions whether our fault or natures. They're always there and a pecan could never survive without them, it has no way of extending tissue that finds water, contacts then transference the moisture thru it's root hairs, this is the purpose of the micor and in return, the relationship feeds the carb to the fungi it couldn't process on it's own.

Symbiosis. A hard term to understand yet a simple description of every living thing's need to rely on everything else, in spite of our own misunderstandings of ecology, which Reagan successfully convinced us was a bad word.
 

sotc

Dormant hero!!
Joined
Dec 6, 2005
Messages
21,739
Location
So. Oregon
sounds like a good question to submit to dr mike in his "ask dr mike" link since hes studied it deeply
 

TC3

Headache !
Joined
Aug 12, 2006
Messages
1,505
Location
Michigan
It's true.

What's a problem is that the market people aren't understanding of how species-specific certain strains of their products are and are represented as the cure-all and applications encouraged to all trees, regardless of family bet it Beech or Pine.
I hear you loud-n-clear, Reed.
BUT >>> If a myco is introduced that has a span a 64 species (as I have previously mentioned) , would it not stand to reason that there's a pretty good chance of introducing a useful Myco ???
 
R

RIVERRAT

Guest
As the question was originally worded by Frans the answer is FALSE!
 

treelooker

Treehouser
Joined
Jul 24, 2005
Messages
1,013
Location
NC
As the question was originally worded by Frans the answer is FALSE!
Yeah but then he changed the question.

Oops, was that another "assault"? :\:

Dr. Mike gave a good talk at expo. he came right after me in the same room so it was an easy decision to stay. he handled questions well and avoided infomercialism--i didn't even know he had a corporate affiliation until later.

there's a fungus id thread at AS right now; someone posted a pic of pisolithus tinctorius, a fungus that gets it on with many many species. I'm not so sure about that numbering thingy.
 
F

Frans

Guest
I prob. just forgot the original question. Senility.
Treelooker I'm cool. Just really dont understand the answer to this (new?) question:

Do trees require mycor. in order to live?
 

TC3

Headache !
Joined
Aug 12, 2006
Messages
1,505
Location
Michigan
Do trees need soil in order to live ? Technically, no.
We're hung up on this... "technically"... WHAT DO TREES ACTUALLY NEED ???
Just like we're hung up on wether or not myco is present in the soil & needs a release versus introducing it.
I say we do nuthing.
Yeah.
Otherwise, we're pedaling snake oil, right ???
 

Paul B

I dig hammocks.
Joined
Mar 6, 2005
Messages
12,712
Location
Burnaby BC
Need no, benefit from quite possibly. \
I have seen lots of plants grown in systems (hydroponic) that incorporate UV filtration (likely nothing alive in the water at all) and I have seen systems that have been using organic ferts, myco (generic blend of ecto and endo, not sure how many species) and both systems have worked. which is better? Dunno, never seen a lab style test run with a control, system with and system without using no other variables.

I generally will suggest myco application when planting up on sites that have had no vegetation for a few months or more but planting in established beds and such I dont usually bother.

I would like to see a magnication of a view of soils or hydroponic runoff when using myco and different ferts like organics (kelp, guanos etc) vs non organic ferts like 20-20-20 or what not. time lapse evidence of effect on the myco.

I have used myco a number of years ago when planting some hostas in pots, the ones I used the myco on had WAY more roots and much thicker roots by the end of summer than the ones that didnt. only catch, they werent all the same variety so in the long run the results dont mean much.
 

TC3

Headache !
Joined
Aug 12, 2006
Messages
1,505
Location
Michigan
I like the idea of transporting soil from a planting site, even when there's no real means of transplanting actual roots.
There's a much higher chance of introducing (existing) mycorrhizae to a tree by means of the soil that existed around it, no ?
 

Paul B

I dig hammocks.
Joined
Mar 6, 2005
Messages
12,712
Location
Burnaby BC
TC. yup I have considered that too. and if you can get soil from around a healthy specimen of the same species, theoretically it would narrow down the odds of getting the right species of myco to your potential host, no?
 

treelooker

Treehouser
Joined
Jul 24, 2005
Messages
1,013
Location
NC
TC. yup I have considered that too. and if you can get soil from around a healthy specimen of the same species, theoretically it would narrow down the odds of getting the right species of myco to your potential host, no?
Absolutely you guys are on to something. I've harvested fresh myco from forest oaks and inoculated urban oaks with it.
 
The Tree House Loves TreeStuff!
Top