Hydrovac, jetting, tractor PTO powered water excavation

[pantheraba]

Kyle mentioned hydrovac in another thread (Generator thread). We have a spill well in a pond at our farm in S. GA. Beaers have domed it over with mud. I was able to poke a hole thru the dome, wallered the pole around (7 ft pole) and managed to get a little water running. Came back an hour later and tried to enlarge the drain and it stopped...we must have managed to get mud in the little drain area available. We spent several hours with hoes and poles breaking up mud and trying to access better the drain pipe in the bottom of the 4x4 by 6 foot deep spill well...no luck.

I am thinking a jet of water could blast out the mud and get it flowing again. The pond is getting overfull and has already topped the dam in two places. I cleared a beaver clog in another part of the pond and it is draining off excess water. But the spill well is the best answer.

Anyone have experience with tractor driven PTO water pumps that could be used to generate high pressure flow to break up the beaver's mud/sand sludge? I have been researching them but wonder if y'all have done such a thing?

 

[lumberjack]

I used two normal gas powered pumps when I needed a volume of water at better than garden hose pressure... it’s not an approved practice but I ran them in series, one pulling water out of the creek feeding the inlet of the next pump.

It was part of a relatively high budget project and made the 2” line shoot some water out.

 

[Altissimus]

I worked at a hatchery ... Yep I did , me , a professional fish gutter. We used pressure washers with most powerful jet. Cleared many lines of shit , also have done this on perimeter drains.

 

[pantheraba]

Carl, How well would that kind of pressure move dirt/mud? We are considering using a high power pressure washer (I think Alex said in the 4000psi range...one that can run a surface cleaner jet device [driveway for example]...he used to run one pressure washing gas station pump areas).

We could use a jet tip with it but I am not sure if the volume of water is high enough. And it needs clean water...using the pond water at the site is ideal instead of bringing 200-300 gallons of clean water to the pond.

 

[pantheraba]

So, Altissimus...you cleared clogged lines with a good pressure washer? We may run it from downstream up towards the spillwell. The spillwell feeds into an under the road pipe that must have some clog at some point...ideally mostly mud.

 

[BlackSmith]

Got any friends at the VFD..? A brush truck might solve the issue.

 

[Nutball]

I've run a hose with no attachments on a well pump that supposedly maintains 70psi, I don't know what volume it is rated for, but you didn't need a nozzle for blasting dry mud off an ATV. The water stream hitting you would hurt, letting go of the hose would make it fly around.

So, with that in mind, maybe look for a pump that could do 50-100psi through 3/4" ID hose.

My house pressure is around 60psi I think, but by the time it comes out a 1/2" hose and I guess 1/2" pipes under the house, it is pitiful in comparison to that well pump.

 

[Tree09]

The actual suck trucks utilize a rotating tip 10k psi pressure washer to apply as much force as possible to dig. Even the baby trailer ones have an insane pressure washer. The suction side is usually a roots blower, often 8 inch diameter (on a crane boom) on the trucks and 3 to 4 inch on the baby trailers. The trucks will dry suck compacted sand like it's not even there, we used to bury stuff in sand if we had to dig it out again, nice little trick. Compared to digging with a hoe it's like digging in slow motion, but it has its place. You can still cut lines if you aren't careful, and need to be careful of cave ins, especially because the best way to dig is by undermining an area and then liquifying the dirt just enough to get sucked up and not plug the hose.

If you can't get a machine there, hydro digging would definitely work as long as there's not a bunch of logs or rocks, which of course stop a hydro machine in it's tracks. However you will need to suck it somehow, and then deal with the watery spoils, which is like a mudslide and have to be dealt with carefully not to run in a waterway. It will dry in time, but something to keep in mind.

I've successfully used a shop vac to do the sucking part, but that wouldn't likely work where there's that much water. I don't know if there's a trash pump that can work with a prime, because you will suck air as much as muddy water. A shop vac won't suck for a very long distance, but you could probably get close enough for it to work. It'll dig about as fast as manually digging dry dirt, so it actually does ok. A dedicated unit obviously digs much faster.

I used both a small 2500 psi electric pressure washer and a 4500 psi gas driven one, both worked well, zero degree tip or a turbo one if you got it. Like i said, i would dig it with a backhoe or something preferably, but lacking that, you could do worse than a redneck hydro setup. Here's a video of a guy digging post holes, don't shove the tip in the dirt because it'll just mess it up (let the tool do the work) and obviously wear safety glasses and maybe even a clear faceshield. The guys that run them all day wear rain gear and a faceshield. It will really dig that fast in hardened clay, especially if you pothole down first, leave the suction at the bottom of the hole, then work out and wash the dirt to the suction hose.

 

[pantheraba]

Thanks for the input, Patrick. Kyle...good video. Hadn't found that one yet.

 

[pantheraba]

Whatever we blow out will end up washing downstream once the pipe opens...hoping the compacted mud will dissolve enough to fall out of the way as the tip goes forward. As I understand a jet tip, it should blow stuff back behind it while it moves forward.

 

[flushcut]

In the dental field we used a vibrating table to get dental plaster to flow in the impressions and I am positive mud has the same properties as dental plaster while wet. Maybe a concrete vibrator down or near the pipe with some lower water pressure but high volume might do the trick instead of dealing with high pressure. And probably cheaper any contractor rental yard should have a "dildo" as they are referred to in the industry.

 

[Tree09]

If that's the case then yeah, this might work. I would pothole down to the drain, maybe simply hand digging if needed. If not then shop vac. Then cut a channel to the water, and then widen the sides as the pond is draining, flushing it all away. You likely will still have digging to get it all, but that would do a ton of the work for you. You can use a submersible pump to feed the pressure washer.

 

[lumberjack]

Carl, How well would that kind of pressure move dirt/mud? We are considering using a high power pressure washer (I think Alex said in the 4000psi range...one that can run a surface cleaner jet device [driveway for example]...he used to run one pressure washing gas station pump areas).

We could use a jet tip with it but I am not sure if the volume of water is high enough. And it needs clean water...using the pond water at the site is ideal instead of bringing 200-300 gallons of clean water to the pond.

It would certainly blast mud. It combined with a pressure washer could probably dig in virgin ground using the flow to clear what the pressure washer cut.


You don’t need fancy nozzles or stupid high pressure to cut dirt, dirt isn’t hard, mud is softer. We jetted a sewer line with a normal pressure washer, found an y that wasn’t capped with our hose prairie dogged in the yard.

Could you run the “jet” up from the downstream end?