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Chainsaw Dawgs! (Falling Spikes)

Burnham

Woods walker
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Mar 7, 2005
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Western Oregon
I'm with the "sometimes have to stay with the cut as the tree goes" crowd, too. Even if I am usually in conifers :). For example, with some head lean, the tree is likely to commit to the face before you can get the hinge squared up to the intended lay. If you quit then, leaving an uneven hinge, the tree will almost certainly pull to the thick side of the hinge rather than straight to your lay.

One could avoid that by boring the back cut, sure. But I only do that on a heavier head lean. For milder cases, just stick with the cut for another second or two to finish it properly before beating feet away. I'm still long gone from the stump by the time the tree breaks the hinge.
 

Magnus

TreeHouser
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May 6, 2005
Messages
4,454
Location
South East Sweden
When I was cutting we used trigger and wedges. Really heavy leaner that trigger could not hold were held by cable and let down as cut was done. If you do cut right and let tree go controlled, it is pretty much as safe as it gets for feller and wood.
Too high risk of damage to the wood. Fiber pull, hairline crack or ring crack and that trunk was just a couple percent of value.
Now its pretty much mandatory here. Even has its own new name now (Safety corner) instead of trigger as we called it then.
 

Huntaholic

Treehouser
Joined
Dec 5, 2018
Messages
23
Location
Tennessee
JIMMINEY FRIGGIN CHRISTMAS!!! Im sorry Magnus, but theres no way in Hades that Im cutting a heavy leaner, letting it go the way its leaning, with a cable tied in it above my head!!! You know whats going to happen??? I will tell you whats going to happen, that butt cut is going to kick back off the stump and on YOU! NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE!!!!!!! I know conditions and understory are different around the world and in the woods, but Ive seen way too many folks post about cutting and running as the tree starts to fall. 9 times out of 10 Im not running more than a few feet. If youre anywhere within the reach of that trunk or the canopy of it, the safest place to be is close to the stump AS LONG AS YOU ARE LOOKING UP.

Let me add that I am NOT trying to start an argument with ANYBODY here! Im the "new guy" on the block so to speak and as such I have a ton of respect for the long time members. All I am trying to convey is the methods of cutting that work best and are safest for ME!
 

Stumpshot

General Purpose
Joined
Jun 30, 2018
Messages
1,495
Location
Kansas City
Bailey's calls them either felling dogs or bumper spikes.
First term sounds cool, second one sounds sissy...
 

flushcut

TreeHouser
Joined
Jan 15, 2011
Messages
13,221
Location
Delavan, WI
I think the propper term is bumper spikes, but dawgs has a better ring to it. Like, saw dawgs, just flows off of the tongue nicely.

I agree about the dawgs being substandard. I modded the dawg by welding a longer point on the bottom works much better now I have a pivot point. I'll grab a pic later.
 

SeanKroll

Treehouser
Joined
Oct 13, 2016
Messages
7,080
Location
Olympia, WA
There are some Announcement subforum Stickies, giving useful info.

You can Go Advanced
and Manage Attachments
Add File
Choose File
Upload
Repeat as desired
Insert Inline


Also, there is a picture icon, in the top of the Quick Reply box, for uploading.

This is the "Go Advanced" screen

Screenshot_2018-12-09-09-28-30.png
 

flushcut

TreeHouser
Joined
Jan 15, 2011
Messages
13,221
Location
Delavan, WI
Pics Image 1.jpg Image.jpg
You can see how much I added and it has made a huge improvement you can now dawg in and sweep. The point is a touch below the plane of the bottom of the saw a little hard on the truck bed but not to bad. Maybe a cutoff disc kerf width and reweld would fix that, if I get around to it, ever, maybe. The saw is a 545 and have done the same with my 550.
 

squisher

THE CALM ONE!!!!
Joined
Sep 25, 2006
Messages
23,795
Location
Vernon, B.C.
JIMMINEY FRIGGIN CHRISTMAS!!! Im sorry Magnus, but theres no way in Hades that Im cutting a heavy leaner, letting it go the way its leaning, with a cable tied in it above my head!!! You know whats going to happen??? I will tell you whats going to happen, that butt cut is going to kick back off the stump and on YOU! NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE!!!!!!! I know conditions and understory are different around the world and in the woods, but Ive seen way too many folks post about cutting and running as the tree starts to fall. 9 times out of 10 Im not running more than a few feet. If youre anywhere within the reach of that trunk or the canopy of it, the safest place to be is close to the stump AS LONG AS YOU ARE LOOKING UP.

Let me add that I am NOT trying to start an argument with ANYBODY here! Im the "new guy" on the block so to speak and as such I have a ton of respect for the long time members. All I am trying to convey is the methods of cutting that work best and are safest for ME!
Maybe a difference between hardwood and soft but in BC staying near the stump is a fools errand. That's where shit comes raining down the most. Best have a couple escape paths and use them. Primary and secondary. Not saying duck your head and run blindly but worksafeBC has the stats and staying with the stump ups your probability for injury or death greatly. I'm assuming it's different in hardwoods.
 

flushcut

TreeHouser
Joined
Jan 15, 2011
Messages
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Location
Delavan, WI
Also a little different working the woods as opposed to the neighborhood yard tree.
Today we had a mix of both and I gotta out of Dodge and away from the stump, lotsa shit raining down.
 

Huntaholic

Treehouser
Joined
Dec 5, 2018
Messages
23
Location
Tennessee
Im sure its different depending on location, tree type, understory, terrain, etc... Where I do most of my cutting is in the hills and once you get the bottom cut out, the ones on the hillside generally will go downhill and I make it a point to try to fell my trees into an already open spot. Grapevines, leaners lodged in the tree youre cutting and ROCKS coming down on you are the biggest things to watch for.
 

squisher

THE CALM ONE!!!!
Joined
Sep 25, 2006
Messages
23,795
Location
Vernon, B.C.
Here the debris showers down from the face you're working on. Not from trees it strikes when going to the lay(assuming the strip has already been opened up). Clearcut is the norm here so you're falling to a lay downhill or sidehill in steep ground where there could be a increased chance of brushing other trees. But generally the debris is showering down from the face you're working and the trees contact or interlock with other standing trees. A primary and secondary escape path that you move along while keeping an eye for overhead dangers is the norm and standard/rule. Not staying at the stump longer than necessary. And not returning to the stump or saw(if left behind) until after everything has settled.
 

Magnus

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May 6, 2005
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South East Sweden
Its not just falling branches as tree start to move. Its many reasons.
Barberchair! Broken trunks etc
Stump jumping butts. Tree moving unexpected as it start to go. Stump surfers that send trunk 10m behind stump.
The shift in weight can get stump to crack, break or as I found out ones, even explode.
There is many reasons...
There is nothing you can do then as you could not do before it starts to go.

Standing there when cutting will result in injury in some way sooner or later.
Its not just hardwood as I had experience of. Its all felling. Not just me saying it its all fallers here. Education, certificates, forrest companys etc.. All try to teach this.

Not standing there saved my life a couple times, Of this I am dead certain.

I promise you if you stand there running saw as it goes and it pinches, your eyes is not up.
Neither if is not so good place it stands and you need to see were you put feet...
 

squisher

THE CALM ONE!!!!
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Sep 25, 2006
Messages
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Location
Vernon, B.C.
I agree all sorts of bad things can happen at the stump not just branches showering down. Many of the things you mentioned and countless more variables. I remember doing a snag felling contract as a young and fairly inexperienced guy. In over my head but getting paid. Lol. I put a face in this one old rotten pig and the instant I started my backcut that sucker started coming down on itself like it was imploding and spitting out the bottom. There was no looking up, around or anywhere else except for running for my life, saw dropped, head down and tail tucked. I got lucky that day and I remember the saw did too amazingly. Gave me some perspective on how far a tree can be gone and still standing.

I think most would,agree there is no cookie cutter procedure to cover all trees. Part of the allure of the work is every tree and situation is different and requires full consideration and assessment. But in general and by training rules and regs here you don't stay at the stump longer than necessary.
 

Huntaholic

Treehouser
Joined
Dec 5, 2018
Messages
23
Location
Tennessee
I agree all sorts of bad things can happen at the stump not just branches showering down. Many of the things you mentioned and countless more variables. I remember doing a snag felling contract as a young and fairly inexperienced guy. In over my head but getting paid. Lol. I put a face in this one old rotten pig and the instant I started my backcut that sucker started coming down on itself like it was imploding and spitting out the bottom. There was no looking up, around or anywhere else except for running for my life, saw dropped, head down and tail tucked. I got lucky that day and I remember the saw did too amazingly. Gave me some perspective on how far a tree can be gone and still standing.

I think most would,agree there is no cookie cutter procedure to cover all trees. Part of the allure of the work is every tree and situation is different and requires full consideration and assessment. But in general and by training rules and regs here you don't stay at the stump longer than necessary.
All of this I agree with. I never said I stood at every stump and played ring around the roses with falling trees. In closing, we all do it the best way we know how and so far its worked for us, we are still here! I think it would be a great idea for us to go to each others job sites and watch the others work if the opportunity ever arises. Im certain we can all learn something from each other.
 

squisher

THE CALM ONE!!!!
Joined
Sep 25, 2006
Messages
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Location
Vernon, B.C.
:thumbup:

I hear what you're saying. I was curious if there is quite a difference to how hazards present themselves with conifer logging vs deciduous.
 

Huntaholic

Treehouser
Joined
Dec 5, 2018
Messages
23
Location
Tennessee
Ive cut very few coniferous trees, probably 100,000 ft or less and that was mostly pine so I cant say as to the differences. Of those I have cut, I remember them being way less prone to splitting than hardwoods though so I can see how getting away from the stump is very viable.
 

Burnham

Woods walker
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Mar 7, 2005
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17,423
Location
Western Oregon
Doesn't matter what sort of tree your felling...if you're felling in the woods, the stump is a very dangerous place.
 
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