Propping a small apple tree

[NickfromWI]

I have a client with a small apple tree (15' tall, 15' canopy, 8" DBH) that is falling over. You can see the root plate lifting up on one side.

With a local welder I've designed this prop to hold up the tree. It hasn't been presented to the client yet. What are your thoughts?

Over all it's about 10' long, pivoting at the bottom, threaded on the top so it can extend for a perfect installation. There will be an articulating hinge thingy (that's the technical term) at the top so that regardless of the angle of the tree, it will sit flush against the trunk.

Let me know what you think. What do you think it'd cost to get it built? How much would you charge for the install?

Overall View


The Base


The Top


The Articulating End

love
nick

 

[Al Smith]

Why not just sink an anchor in the ground and cable it off .Danged apple trees can get such a fruit load on them it breaks the tree down .

 

[NickfromWI]

The trunk of the tree is about 10'-15' from the house and leaning away from the house. The ground anchor would have to go right into the sidewalk...just not feasible. There isn't room.

Thus, I get to do this fun stuff

 

[Al Smith]

Take a look sometime at a power pole with a short stiff arm going straight down to an anchor . That's called a sidewalk guy because it's used in restricted areas such as you mentioned . If I can "google " up a picture I'll post it .

 

[flushcut]

I think it will work along with a crown redux. Any thoughts as to why it failed in the first place?

 

[Al Smith]

Here ya go,about halfway down the page http://www.tpub.com/ceb/37.htm

 

[SouthSoundTree]

Seems overly complicated.

I've not read the ISA propping BMP, but I seem to remember that a hole drilled into the tree a little bit, a la a partially drilled through-bolt hole, with a post to insert into the tree was one method suggested elsewhere. The support rod/ post can be inserted into a larger prop, if the strength is needed. I'd dig a hole for the "foot" of the prop, allowing the rod/ post to be installed into the hole. Then fill the hole with wet concrete. Alignment is correct.

You could buy a treated 4x4 fence post, drill into the end, insert metal rod/ post (rebar?). Maybe do the same on the other end so you don't have wood in concrete to rot (I imagine L.A. has drier weather than Olympia, and posts last longer in the ground) and you'd have about $8 into the prop, and a couple bucks into the concrete.

 

[Burnham]

Why not just pull the tree all the way upright and guy it straight with three guys?

 

[Al Smith]

The anchors come in all different load ratings from like 3,000 pounds to upwards of 20,000 lbs . The later use big rods like 1 1/4" inch .

Even a 3-5000 pound expanding pole anchor set 6 feet deep won't pull out .Besides that if the tree does come down you just unscrew the anchor rod leaving the anchor buried and nobody is the wiser .Out of sight,out of mind .Just an option .

 

[NickfromWI]

I think it will work along with a crown redux. Any thoughts as to why it failed in the first place?

Yeah- The root flare only goes around half the tree. I think it was just a crummy nursery tree with girdled roots (didn't excavate to find out, though), but there is no flare on inside of the lean.

Al- That is a good idea to keep in mind. It wouldn't work here. The tree is 15' tall, and the wood strong enough to hold anything is at around 6-7' up. That means we'd have support cables RIGHT over head and maybe low enough that some would have to duck to get under.

I like the idea of drilling a hold part way into the tree. Hmmmm....

The last 2 props I've done were both wood. The client really wants steel because there was a tree at her college that was propped with steel I-beams and it "seemed right" to her. I'm cool with that.

Burnham, you didn't read the other posts, did you? Shame shame!

love
nick

 

[NickfromWI]

I've not read the ISA propping BMP...

Neither have I, but seeing as how this is the third time I've done this, I guess I should. Anyone have a copy I can preview?!

love
nick

 

[Burnham]

I did, Nick...sorry, what did I miss?

 

[Burnham]

Ohhhh, I did miss your post about the sidewalk, my bad!

 

[flushcut]

I C.

 

[NickfromWI]

I already set the price, but interested...what do you think y'all would charge for such a thing?

 

[flushcut]

I think the brace to make would be around 200 (at a guess) parts and labor. Maybe 300.

 

[Burnham]

BTW, you can brace over a sidewalk, driveway, or road even. All it takes is a horizontal pole tall enough to give the clearance you need, set on the opposite side of the travelway. Then run a cable from the tree to the top of the pole. Then guy the top of the pole down to the ground opposite the cable from the tree.

Nick's situation might still not be workable this way, but I thought it might be worth noting.

 

[SouthSoundTree]

What about an aluminum pipe or two with hemispherical plasticy end-caps on a tapered end?

or

I-beam or t-post, with a tapered end, blunt and/ or plastic capped. Have it galvanized.

As far as the plastic cap, it seems like until the tree grows around the prop and "holds" it rigidly, it will rock somewhat, grinding away at the bark and on inward. Harder/ impossible to establish an effective Wall 4 with ongoing damage.

 

[Marc-Antoine]

The base plate will slip quickly. The spikes aren't enough to hold it like that just on the ground. With the wind shaking and some rain, the spikes will be pushed throw the grass and dirt by the plate. So it doesn't stay in place.

The plate doesn't need to be hinged. A simple 4"x4", straight welded on the post. Just bury it in the ground, under the soil's soft layer. Dig the hole with a bottom at 45° and put the plate flat on it. Pack down the dirt over and that should be good for a long time.

 

[Paul B]

Euthanize and replant.

 

[SouthSoundTree]

Seems like system with a two-dimensional support for the prop might be worth considering. If the tree's root system is already failing, some of the roots have been likely compromised by the tipping. It would be unfortunate to prop it in one direction, and have it tip to the side.

 

[sotc]

I tend to agree with Marc, the first wind that lifts the tree will likely pull that right out. Post hole digger and sack of quick crete. I also agree with Paul, r&r. If they truely want to spend $4-500 for an apple, fine but they should know that the tree has already failed, no one has checked to find out why and for less $ they could have any variety in possibly a better location. .02

 

[Burnham]

I'm with Willie, darn if he isn't a smart fella, isn't he?

 

[NickfromWI]

Seems like system with a two-dimensional support for the prop might be worth considering. If the tree's root system is already failing, some of the roots have been likely compromised by the tipping. It would be unfortunate to prop it in one direction, and have it tip to the side.

There will be 2 of the aforementioned props holding it up out at angles on the downhill side. The tree has a solid lean and I'm betting it will never fall AWAY from the lean. The two props will provide support against a straight downward fall or anything off to the left or right.

...and for less $ they could have any variety in possibly a better location...

They both understand that they are about to spend a lot of money on the tree. But they explained it to me very well: it's not the apples they want, it's the idea. Right now they have a tree and they have a 3 yr old daughter. In a couple years they will be able to go out a pick apples from the tree with their daughter. They'll be able to make apple pie from the same tree, and that girl will grow up with fond memories connected strongly to that apple tree. It is very rare in LA to have an apple tree this big that produces good fruit. If they remove and replace now, it will be years before the tree is producing lots of fruit like it does now and there is a good chance that they'll miss all the fond memory making.

I'm very tree-huggerish, so I agree with the mentality. Because it's leaning, doesn't mean it fails to be a tree. It just means it's leaning.

love
nick

 

[Burnham]

Apples have an amazing ability to soldier on after having been windthrown, around here. You'll see some real veterans laying out along the ground, still producing fruit. I'm betting it'll work out just fine.