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Integrated Soft Shackle

Brocky

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Hi ruel, why do you think it isn't safe to use? I view it as a type of knot. I will be testing it out,not on the job, but more of a recreational type climb.
 

Brocky

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Maybe but the way the soft shackle works by using a brummel that cinches when loaded, it would be hard to open the brummel by just slacking it. Plus there are numerous types of soft shackles, some being more secure than others.
 

ruel

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Jan 27, 2015
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NOT... LIFE... SUPPORT... could get snagged and open fairly easily when climbing, not double locking, not three actions to open, would wear hard from constant movement against d rings unlike steel or aluminum. Why frig with something that doesn't improve on a carabiner or snap? would take two hands to open and close, and take longer to open or close, with less security. Not a good idea
 

Brocky

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Most times when I use regular soft shackle I put on a sleeve of tubular webbing or the cover from a rope or cord between the stopper and the brummel for chafe protection. In order to open the shackle I have to push this sleeve back, that is one movement. Opening up the brummel, which takes two hands if the shackle is fairly short, is the second movement. Pushing the stopper knot out, while holding the loop open is the third movement. Not easy to do but also makes it hard to accidentally open. It could happen, but the loop would have to be opened and the stopper leveraged out of it. Definitely not ansi compliant by not being auto closing or locking but those are for carabiners and snaps. This falls more under the rope termination section.

When I rec climb I break the ansi rules, is that wrong? Would you no longer free climb a tree just for the fun of it? I don't do anything dangerous but if you use common sense it is safe to deviate from ansi.

Also, I will start out high and fast, er... I mean low and slow!
 

Brocky

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Always, and keep your head in the game. As you say carabiners are easier,but when rec climbing, that is all I'm doing, just climbing, not planning a couple dozen or more steps ahead, as is done when working.

I'm not forecasting that this will replace using carabiners, just something to experiment with and might lead to something else more useful. You don't know until you try.
 

ruel

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Yeah no need to follow ANSI when rec climbing I guess.... Just wanted to make sure I said I'm not stoked about your idea. If you need a carabiner, hit me up. If you're just playing around, be safe.
 

Raj

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Oct 26, 2013
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Brantford, Ontario
Not knocking innovation or trying something different, but up here dyneema is nearly $3/ft, and a biner can be bought for $21.
 

Brocky

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Michigan
The shackle part of the lanyard only takes between 1-2 feet to make, which replaces the carabiner. Your last post sparked an idea to retro fit a regular lanyard by replacing the carabiner with a regular soft shackle through the eye in the lanyard. I won't have to go to the expense of making a new one to try this out. Thanks Peter
 

Brocky

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About 10-12 years ago I started collecting the carabiners and belay devices from the Swiss company Mammut. I liked the design of the then newly released Bionic line, that were totally different from carabiners used in tree work at the time. The two gold colored ones in the second row from the top, especially the left one of the two,a wire gate, were what attracted me to start collecting.
 

Brocky

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I recently decided to stop collecting any more future upgrades or design changes as the Mammut company has been making it difficult to collect all of their newer offerings, from very limited distribution, limited time they are produced and they have a very messed up website at times. Three carabiners of their latest line are only available in Europe, not the easiest way to get them.
 

Brocky

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Here's another use for the soft shackleIMG_1366.jpg
This friction hitch can be used alone in a SRT mode.

Edit: picture loaded sideways for some reason.
 

Brocky

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Michigan
You could just use a loop if putting it on a carabiner, but I plan to attach it directly to my harness as a lanyard hitch.

Edit: Just realized the hitch couldn't be tied without an open end and the soft shackle connection takes up less room then a grapevine knot, and is easier to connect then tying a knot after tying the hitch.
 

Brocky

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The hitch is basically a 4-2 VT with the eyes tied in a overhand knot instead of the second braid in the back. This cord is small, about 5mm so I used the ring. For my regular hitch cords, 7mm-8mm, an oval carabiner works best. The overhand knot is a bit of a problem, as you have to bring the eyes through it. Spliced or tied eyes will need longer lengths so the loop is big enough to pass them through, resulting in long legs on the hitch. At first I tied it with just a length of cord and then tied the two eyes so there would be shorter legs. Once I found the length needed, I went to sewn eyes. The soft shackle cord allows even shorter legs.

I find that this hitch works just as easily as hitches on DdRT. In fact it releases easier then the Wrench. For a fast or long descent I use a belay tube, but just descending while working, the hitch alone works great.
 

Brocky

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Michigan
Forgot to add that a pulley isn't needed to advance it because the overhand knot will do it. Clipping to the legs with your usual method, over the shoulder, neck thingy, or chest harness, will advance it as you climb.
IMG_1315.jpg

Edit: another sideways picture? I'm sure it isn't from my holding the phone wrong while snapping the pic.
 

MasterBlaster

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Mar 6, 2005
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Louisiana!
For some people, for some unknown reason, pics will upload sideways or upside down.

It's not your fault.
 

Brocky

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Aug 5, 2009
Messages
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Location
Michigan
Thanks Butch, I'll try taking the pictures so they will show up right. As an aside, I came up with this hitch, eventually, after trying to modify another hitch on the buzz that came from someone who was also banned. How much innovation has been lost due to some individuals not being allowed to participate?
 
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