Bucket- dump: pros and cons

SeanKroll

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Oct 13, 2016
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Location
Olympia, WA
I'm considering upgrading chip trucks either to a 'regular' dump versus a mid-mount bucket/ dump bed. Been bouncing this inside my head, and could use some experienced feedback.

I've flown a non-dump Versalift for over 2 years, in the past, almost never off pavement.

Some of my trees are bucket accessible, but most aren't, under normal situations.
I deal with very saturated soils during the typical storm season. Storm damage seems like a good time for a bucket. Bad timing.

Good bit of hills here, so leveling out could be difficult on driveways.
Yesterday, I started (3) 130' fir takedowns, if I had someone to move the truck, I could have skipped 45-55' of easy spur climbing, knocking off stubs and a couple limbs. I have a seldom used Wraptor.




Outside of storm times...
A local arborist has an 83' spider lift: $300 mobilization, $500/ hour with operator and his "right-hand man".
Another biz has a 100' bucket, but not sure of subcontract-rates.
Cranes start at $215/ hour, portal to portal.



What are considerations of a bucket dump?

Insurance rates?

Dumping?

Inspection/ Certs?

Maintenance?

Sourcing?

How does having a bucket bring in bucket work in a climber-dependent market? Willie mentioned to only get a bucket truck if a person wants to be busy all the time.


How much use does it need to be useful, considering the lift's life-span, starting around 10 years old? How long is a reasonable used lift expected to last?

What else?
 
Sit down with your work diary, go through every job over the last year and work out if a bucket truck/spider lift would get that job done quicker.

If It’s clear that a spider lift (which I reckon would be your best bet) would get you in and out faster and make you more money (and less wear and tear on you, which I know concerns you)

Then it’s time to phone the bank.
 
Yep, agreed.

And when you settle with the bank, if you aren't at least somewhat nauseous when you sign on the dotted line, you didn't spend enough. If you have the work, the equipment pays for itself no problemo

I might be missing something but 500$/ hr seems mad high
 
I am really enjoying the spider. It's easy on turf and can level out just about anywhere. For example one of tomorrows jobs is setting a cable in a oak at about 60' up, easy money for 30 minutes of work. The lift has been parked in this dead end in a gated community going from one house to the next, 4 neighbors in total.
500 is a bit steep.
 
Agreed $500 hr seems crazy for a tracked lift. I can get a really impressive crane for about half that.

As far as the bucket thing. I guess it really depends on your market/niche. Aka how often is the truck going to sit at the yard?.

Alot of places I can see it almost being a necessity. Here in the mountains, it'd be handy on a few jobs but would sit more days than not.
 
Do you have a consistent ground guy? Bucket/ dumps usually need to be nosed into the tree, so if chipping at the same time you add about 35' to the drag.

Is 55 feet of reach enough in the PNW?
 
Bucket/ dumps usually need to be nosed into the tree, so if chipping at the same time you add about 35' to the drag.

I used to have one, we would frequently disconnect chipper and orient it toward the work (opposite direction of the nose of the truck) to save dragging and brush spinning
 
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  • #8
I consider a tow-behind lift that I can move with my mini. Way, way cheaper than a spider lift, less insurance and better access than a bucket truck.

The job I'm on currently is getting some use out of my chip truck, which normally sits. I chip on-site a lot. I've probably only put 10k on the odometer in 12 years, and I'm trying to only take new customers close to home, as in less than 7 miles.

Mostly, I think a bucket truck would not help much. Right now, I've got some hazard trees, one that I wouldn't
climb.

For $25-30k, I can get a former utility company chip body man-cab it L-Pack truck. Not hard to swallow.
At any point, I may need a chipper (though it was eating like it had a tapeworm today, as usual), and I would liketo focus on my mortgage.
 
$500 an hr plus $300 move in!!
I get people complain when I tell them it's $400 per DAY for the spider lift and $800 per DAY for the tower truck (both rented)
 
How do you guys make any money at those rates? We charge $150 an hour for doing fruit trees.
 
$75 a man hour is what the market will bare. I haven't rented out my toy yet but I know most of the guys in the area and that is what I would charge them if they needed it,$150 hour $300 minimum. And there are some other guys that I would charge $1000 cash or it doesn't leave the trailer. Most trees around here are two hours max to rig out, but there are some all day trees.
 
I assume that your lift cost as much as all the other similar lifts, meaning a lot! Initial purchase, maintenance, savings for replacing parts as they wear out and eventually the entire machine, all takes some serious money.

Have you calculated your rates against all that and its service life in hours? Is there still enough at those rates for net profit?
 
$500 an hour is insanely high. Is that the lift plus one guy or two? Even at two it seems high. Only saying this because I can get one for around a grand for 8 hours with the owner staying present the whole time. It’s been a while since I’ve checked but I’m pretty sure that’s what it was.
Sean a bucket would be nice but I think you would be better off with some sort of mobile lift for your area. I use my bucket a lot but still have many days where it’s nothing more than a giant rolling tool box. The boom can last a long time but 25 years seems to be the cut off for parts being available. Maintenance can get pricey quick as well. Mines 20 years old and I just put around 7 grand in the boom plus around 4 in the truck. Engine is getting tired. Soon I’ll have to make a decision on what to do with that. I’ll either replace the engine, replace the whole truck (upgrade to newer and bigger) or just sell it and change work.
 
I assume that your lift cost as much as all the other similar lifts, meaning a lot! Initial purchase, maintenance, savings for replacing parts as they wear out and eventually the entire machine, all takes some serious money.

Have you calculated your rates against all that and its service life in hours? Is there still enough at those rates for net profit?
I figured those are friendly rates so the other Co. can make some bread on the jobs. My jobs make much better money per hour ;)
 
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  • #16
It is the only Spider-lift I'm aware of in the area.

83' lift, plus two guys.

Probably 1-1.25 hours round trip travel, depending on traffic.






A 60'+7' jib Haullotte 4wd (sp?, French) just became available to rent. About $625/ with fuel, taxes and transport.
 
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  • #18
8 hours in the meter within the 24 hour rental-day.


I was using a friend's Genie 35'/ 22' side reach today. Slight slope to the driveway. Took some getting used to.
I wonder how much your spider lift moves around.

Only light cut and chuck.

Easy.
 
The towables do feel like you are riding a slinky a bit :lol: I've never used one that small tho
 
8 hours in the meter within the 24 hour rental-day.
I was using a friend's Genie 35'/ 22' side reach today. Slight slope to the driveway. Took some getting used to.
I wonder how much your spider lift moves around.
I compare the spider to rolling ocean instead of wash board road in a bucket truck. The lift is more of a gradual sway but tighter than the Nifty or Genie tow behind with smoother functions. The CMC has a ramp up and ramp down in the hydros speeds so you have less choppy movements.
 
2 months ago I rented a 72' spider w/ trailer for 800 + 600 deposit. Picked it up a Tuesday night and returned it thursday morning. Considered 1 day, this is in nj
 
The towables do feel like you are riding a slinky a bit :lol: I've never used one that small tho

I've run the 72 foot Up Equip spider lift to take down one tree and it was a lot more "whippy" than I would enjoy. Then I did a short test run in the Up Equip 89 foot spider lift and it felt much less so. They pointed out the booms are a little different shape.
 
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