Staying Small

Nland

Treehouser
Joined
Jan 10, 2021
Messages
28
Location
Western NC
Hello all,
Im curious about the small business models across the forum. Who is working with a one truck one chipper sized business? Has anyone contract climbed for most of their career and intentionally not grown? Is anyone making it work with just material on site jobs and subbing out any material handling if necessary?
I look forward to the responses thanks,
Noah
 
Deliberately stayed small , mostly mental reasons (long story long time back but we met an old timer who still climbed even , stay small was his main advice , counted his bucket trucks and quoted his monthly payroll)
 
Starting about 40 years ago I worked with a friend; just the two of us. We did a ton of work. After two years he hired a new groundworker when I went out on my own, with one truck, chipper, and one groundsman. Two other friends were also set up in similar two-person operations. We shared a stump grinder among us all. When larger jobs occurred whomever wasn’t too booked would jump in and help the one with the larger job.
When we bid on large jobs (the first I recall was bidding on 270 trees to prune for Winterthur Gardens) we sat down and figured the bid on all eight of us working together. It worked well for as long as it lasted. It afforded us an economy of scale that kept our costs low but easily ramped up for larger contracts. I moved on to Nursing and part time tree work, one of the fellows has a 15 employee landscape and tree business, my original friend still runs a four person (5 when I add in on crane days) crew, and the fourth person died a few years ago.
Being a small outfit limits in some ways but keeps costs manageable, too.
 
Welcome to the house Noah. I'm a small part time pickup and chipper outfit, slowly growing. Here you will find companies that are mostly smaller, despite some running cranes and everything in between. I'm trying to think of anyone here running multiple crews, which is where i would consider someone starting to get big. I have subbed out parts of the job before, mainly stump grinding but also material handling and trucking, many people have. I also will rent equipment if it makes economic sense.
 
What the numbers have shown since going solo is that better/larger machinery nets more money than super low investment setup. That is assuming one has the volume to pay for overhead, and depending on the local availability/cost of material disposal etc. Went from pickup, to pickup and dump trailer, then 12” chipper, then dump truck, now two dumps with chipper trailer and mini. Way less physical strain with better gear so can work longer and not be blown out next day. Enjoy work more with each upgrade too! Labor is the most expensive part but seems like so many small companies hire a few grunts but lack a material handler or decent chipper??
 
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Thanks for the input! From what I have noticed contract climbing a happy spot is a 1 small skilled crew and the heavier assets (mini skids etc) to handle most grunt work. Im just working out of an F150 right now. Its helpful to be able to get input on what has worked or not.
 
I used a half ton when i was just starting, although i would suggest slowly upgrading to something more beefy. Maybe save up a bit and get a used chipper, i run an old chipmore cnd that works great. Maybe a trailer, and some iron, carts, or other equipment for material handling. Get a few jobs lined up and rent equipment as needed. If you have a really big removal, but can make good money by renting just for that job, then go for it. I've rented a dump trailer, mini, and a grapple quite often, same with lifts as needed. Hunt down equipment on ebay, Craigslist, and the best: different auctions. Learn to weld and fix stuff, and you are halfway there. Good luck!
 
It will vary regionally.

My happiest years in tree work were as a contract climber working out of a VW station wagon. I was able to save money like crazy and when I felt like it, I could take off for weeks at a time.

Eventually, I had the desire to get out of the trading my time for a limited amount of dollars. I also had the urge to work with trees but realized trees really don't need much help. They make great decisions, growing toward light and water. Humans, we are a different story. I realized I had a talent for selling the work and interfacing with humans so I opted to do that in a much more challenging field.

What I learned from grinding on my own as a one man show. Long days, at times brutal work, grinding to get a job done - all things that shaped my ability to hustle and grind now.
 
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Below is a link from a Treebuzz thread and it seems to be a very on-target answer to the OP here.

This guy was either humble- bragging or simply has a very nice business growth story, and he lends more detailed info re chippers vs grapples/not chipping

"OK here it is...First a disclaimer, I am not as experienced or nearly as big of an operator as some on here. We are a one crew operation, and instead of expanding to multiple crews as we grew, we focused on honing our skills and being more efficient. That led to trying different equipment, and trying different things.
As a side note - when something is working for us, we tend to close our minds to how we could better ourselves and what the options are outside of our point of view.
So we started with a 12" chipper, and hand fed everything. When we purchased a mini it was quite a gamechanger. Then we upgraded our chipper so we had hydraulic down pressure, and that was a huge help. After climbing for 9 years, we purchased our first lift...a Nifty SD64. My expectations were low, because we were working a lake market and most of our competition were primarily climbers. After using it, I realized that the profit margins were much better, and we did not need all of the jobs we were bidding to make a good living. We just needed to get the jobs we had the equipment for! That was a major shift in our operation, and from then on we focused primarily on lift work and crane jobs.
I realized that with the additional output of a lift we were going to run into capacity issues, so we decided to try JMAC's truck setup...A rear-mount grapple truck that has a U frame that you can chip into, and it also dumps. At this point I was still convinced that chipping was the best way to get rid of brush.
After a couple of months of chipping brush, and using the grapple to load logs on top, our chipper broke down for a week. My guys figured out that they could get nearly as much in the truck by stomping down the brush with the grapple as chipping, and then when they put the logs that crushed it down even more! So the chipper got left behind more and more, and finally they just quit using it. I will add that it would be overkill if we were just trimming most of the time, and where it shines is crane jobs and multiple removals.
Also where I live the land is a bit cheaper, and although I do get a permit to burn the burning regulations are less. But based on our experience, if I couldn't burn, I still think I would rather put the 50K it would take to buy a big chipper and spend it on land, and hire someone to come in with a tub grinder rather than chipping onsite.
Plus you add the additional value of taking all the wood out in log lengths, it can really make a difference! I actually just started a sawmill with all the logs I have accumulated over the last year, and although I don't expect to be able to fully supply it, it will definitely cut down on how many we will have to purchase."
 
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