Fuel mixture - find any difference using premix vs self mix?

[Robert P]

Have you found any difference in performance or longevity using premix like TruFuel etc. vs mixing your own? Assuming using ethanol-free gas.

While on the subject, do you find any particular oil to be better? Say Walmart store brand vs (fill in the blank). "I won't use anything but ____" or "Nah, it's all about the same..."

Do you mix as close to the exact recommended ratio as possible or do you find things go better if you say make it slightly heavier/lighter on the oil?

 

[SkwerI]

Stihl Ultra (grey bottle) mixed 50-1. I haven't had issues with ethanol in 30 years as long as I use a good synthetic mix oil such as Stihl Ultra. It has very good fuel stabilizers in it so my mix gas stays fresh for months.
I can't afford the premix, works out to something ridiculous like $40-50 per gallon (or more, now).

 

[Mudpro]

We have been using TruFuel for a little over a year. We were running Amsoil synthetic and ethanol free gas prior. I think that the premium synthetic mix oils are absolutely a must for longevity. However, all of our equipment runs far better on the TruFuel. My saw gas cost is $.14/oz. and I have spent $1500 over the last 13 months. My number one reason for the switch is TruFuel doesn't have benzene in it which is a carcinogen. Auto gas does. Not that burning Trufuel isn't still full of all kinds of other bad stuff, just one less really bad thing. Another lesser but still important consideration. No worries about an improperly mixed batch of gas, i.e. no oil, being poured into one or more saws and causing damage. It's expensive for sure and I flinch a little every time I buy it.

 

[lxskllr]

No opinion on longevity, but I haven't noticed a difference in short term performance between the two types. I always use quality synthetic oil for my mix; usually Stihl Ultra. I'd encourage anyone interested in premix to look into Aspen. I haven't used it yet, but I was pleased with the price. I paid $27 for 1.3G. That compares favorably to discount premix, and is some of the cleanest burning fuel around.

edit:
Here's the video someone else posted around here. It's what got me interested in hunting down Aspen. The testing was quick and dirty, but looks like a good representative test for these products without spending a lot of time/money on equipment.

 

[Raj]

I use Red Armor, 40:1 with premium gas for my Stihls. It really cleans carbon and seems to oil the engine very well. I inspect my 088s often and seen the difference, really cleaned up the P and C.

 

[Eric H-L]

I am a homeowner. Use my saws infrequently. I think the premix is worth it in my situation. I have used Husqvarna, Stihl and TrueFuel depending on what’s available. Haven’t noticed any difference. I do think it’s probably better to stick with one. It seems that the chip needs to re-tune the saw when I switch.

 

[Bart]

I switched from the regular 50:1 stihl oil to the synthetic for a while and thought I could perceive a difference, easier starting maybe but reverted back due to $. I use alcohol free premium.

 

[BeerGeek]

I've still got a few cans left of 100 octane, low lead, airplane fuel I use with either Red Max Premium or Stihl Ultra, mixed about 45:1. Not looking forward to my next trip to the airport for it, what with Joe's "I did that!" prices (they were $4.85 a year ago).

 

[davidwyby]

Among saw dorks or pros, Ultra does not have a good rep. Stihl sells decarbonizer for a reason...

Based on some crazy testing running stuff lean to destruction, Amsoil is very good and about any other synthetic is good enough. Red Armor is good. Walmart Super Tech Synthetic is good, probably the best value.

I use bottled premix for storage. Stuff does run Good on it! Recently found a pump with ethanol free an hour away, excited about that.

Lead isn't good, and saws don't have enough compression for a lot of octane. There is more bad stuff than benzene in pump gas...I disremember what the other two are.

 

[Trains]

Running avgas 100 octane leaded does not help, or benefit your saw, or any lower lead fuel for that matter.

ive cleaned enough plugs from continental and lycoming engines to remove lead build up to see what it does on 4 strokes, and have also inspected saws from chaps who had their own aircraft, and used avgas on their saws, they had score marks from lead galling on the piston, ie a bit of lead build up came loose (like bits of exhaust carbon), and scored the piston.
Unless you have modified the saw greatly, and thus it needs the higher octane rating, running high octane leaded fuel does nothing for extra power for your saw.

Get fresh fuel, preferably not with ethanol, and mix correctly, I mix and use 32:1 in all my saws, have done so for many years, and not had fouled plugs etc, but its your saw, mix the ratio you want, Ive rebuilt enough saws on leaner oil ratios to decide not run mine on leaner mix's.

Want to see a bunch of people go overboard on mix ratios and oil type, check out the rotax threads on aviation forums .

makes us chainsaw users look like amateurs LOL.

 

[BeerGeek]

My issue is that my stupid state won't allow non-ethanol gas to be sold in pumps, other than the AV gas (I'd have to drive 2+ hrs each way to PA or NY to get ethanol free, so not optimal there). Seeing how some of my saws sit for months without being used, I'd rather have non-ethanol sitting in them. I've been running my saws on it for 7+ yrs, with no plug or piston issues, so no concerns from my end. Thanks for the info, nonetheless.

 

[Tree09]

If they get it wrong they die tho....

 

[davidwyby]

@BeerGeek I buy a little trufuel (VP seems to start best) and drain/run the eth out then start/store with a little non E canned gas.

 

[Cobleskill]

I have an Echo 3400 top handle I bought new in the 90's. It was about half the price of a Stihl, although I should have bought one of those. Ran corn gas all it's life.

I ran the thing for a good 10 years and it never had a lot of guts and lost quite a bit. So it got semi-retired and sits for sometimes a year. I loaned it out to a bud till it got dull. Took it home to sharpen it. Sat for a good year and I thought I should make sure it still runs before I sharpen it. Nope. Primer bulb cracked. Just put a new one in after another 4 or 5 months and fired right up.

Funny how people have problems with ethanol. I think I put one carb kit in it and replaced the fuel lines. Damned thing won't stop running.

 

[Nutball]

Have you found any difference in performance or longevity using premix like TruFuel etc. vs mixing your own? Assuming using ethanol-free gas.

While on the subject, do you find any particular oil to be better? Say Walmart store brand vs (fill in the blank). "I won't use anything but ____" or "Nah, it's all about the same..."

Do you mix as close to the exact recommended ratio as possible or do you find things go better if you say make it slightly heavier/lighter on the oil?

I'm not too concerned about the precise ratio, but I might change it throughout the year as weather changes, if I don't need to or feel like adjusting the carb. More oil makes them run slightly leaner, less makes them run slightly richer. Most any oil these days is good. I'm of the opinion that running 32:1 guarantees a long engine life as long as nothing else goes wrong, but more than 32:1 is wasting oil.

My number one reason for the switch is TruFuel doesn't have benzene in it which is a carcinogen.

Are you sure? I haven't checked the data sheet, but I also haven't seen anywhere obvious that there's no benzene. Alkylate fuel from Aspen or Stihl doesn't have it.

I'd encourage anyone interested in premix to look into Aspen. I haven't used it yet, but I was pleased with the price. I paid $27 for 1.3G.

Where did you find it? As long as it is cheaper than Stihl's stuff, it is worth it, and I'd like some.

I use Red Armor, 40:1 with premium gas for my Stihls. It really cleans carbon and seems to oil the engine very well. I inspect my 088s often and seen the difference, really cleaned up the P and C.

But what does the muffler look like?

My issue is that my stupid state won't allow non-ethanol gas to be sold in pumps, other than the AV gas (I'd have to drive 2+ hrs each way to PA or NY to get ethanol free, so not optimal there). Seeing how some of my saws sit for months without being used, I'd rather have non-ethanol sitting in them. I've been running my saws on it for 7+ yrs, with no plug or piston issues, so no concerns from my end. Thanks for the info, nonetheless.

I empty the tank, then run some Stihl alkylate fuel through before storing my saws long term, or I just use extra stabilizer and a good oil. I've had saws sit for a whole year and start fine. If your state allows it, you can order barrels of fuel, like 5gal drums of optima 95.

 

[lxskllr]

Where did you find it? As long as it is cheaper than Stihl's stuff, it is worth it, and I'd like some.

Checkout their product finder here...

Find dealer

Find dealers of Aspen 2 and Aspen 4.

www.aspenfuels.us

I got it from a local place I barely knew was there. A small shop who's primary business I think is selling sheds.

 

[stig]

I probably run more fuel through saws than anyone else here, and simply don't understand threads like this.
Do you think they invented alkylate premix for fun?

 

[SkwerI]

The problem with using a different fuel for long term storage is that most of us never know when we will need the saw again. I might use it next week or it may be a year.

I have a 32 year old Echo string trimmer that I just dropped off at the saw shop to get it running again. It was running weak a few years ago, but I only used it 2-3 times per year. After losing my business in 2020 I haven't used it since. I assumed I would need a new carb, fuel lines, etc. Nope, they put fresh gas in it and it fired right up! I had them go ahead and replace the fuel lines, air filter and plug just for good measure.

Too many people blame the fuel IMO. No need for 32-1, that was 40 years ago and the oils today are not the same. 50-1 with a good synthetic and whatever gas is coming out of the pump at your local convenience store is just fine.

 

[Magnus]

Buying Aspen save the customers a bunch of money and trouble.
It has been checked here several times. Cost per saw and year will be a lot less. Especially if they don't run much.

But be careful when shifting fuels try to avoid that and do it after internal cleaning or new saw.
I clean all saws inside, remove all crap, carbon and goo, replace fuel line and membranes and off they go.
If not there is a risk it will go caboom when the fuel changes as the properties in the fuels vary quite a bit, especially the oils.

 

[lxskllr]

Makes sense to me. Sometimes, even doing something wrong maintains equilibrium in the system, and everything functions. "Improve" on the system, the balance gets altered, and things break down. I suspect that was my problem switching from corn gas to corn free. I had a chainsaw and two lawnmowers that worked well enough on corn gas, but they all died shortly after switching to corn free as the only change.

 

[Magnus]

Well fixing non broken stuff is never a good idea.
Changing fuels may seem like a bright idea, but it is very seldom just to flip cans, usually more is needed.

 

[Treeaddict]

Stig, what do you and your crew run fuel wise?

 

[stig]

Alkylate premix.