Is a Port-A-Wrap a "must have" if only doing Horizontal Rigging?

Brian, i have to thank you again for suggesting trunk wraps on that big oak I did way back and smoked a rope on my large porty. I still use that advise in a pinch when needed. A tree trunk or stump makes a great bollard. Old school before old school was new school.
I own 4 portys in 3 sizes. A KK devise and a Hobbs. Every tool has its place and function. I use portys a lot. 3 rigging bags and one climb bag. All have a porty.
Thanks again Brian my friend for the times you have saved my bacon with your simple sound and honest advise.
 
I hope next year sometime comes soon. ISC wouldn’t tell me much even though I hung around there quite a bit at the expo. Couldn’t talk them into letting me test it either.
 
What does ' rat tail' mean, TreeSpyder?
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rat-tail-sea-rescue-friction-hitch.jpg

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Woody was looking at your site.
May I suggest lining up with someone that grinds stumps,
Find out what takes to rent one,
Keeping track of stumps on flat ground you leave in your wake,
Hawk an opening to rent grinder when can make ton of money quickly
Visiting old stumps for stump or any other service also
So much more so then I don't do stumps, but they make a nice plant stand.
As a business, service and appearance plan.
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Trailer w/o sides loads and empties easier.
Bull dozer can clear or just hold blade a foot over as you pull forward.
If pre tie ropes to rear of trailer trace up trailer to truck, load brush crossways, at delivery point throw pre tied ropes over load for other truck to pull off, or tie to tree pull forward. 2/1 dump
Another no sides trailer trick is load cross ways, ends to one side especially on base.
>>to unload robe over top from side to lace under bottom layer ends and other vehicle flips load of sideways with rope.
 
It appears the Port-A-Wrap was designed for use in "vertical" rigging -- porty attached low on the trunk to lower pieces from up in the tree.

However there are several pictures and examples here of folks using a Port-A-Wrap for more "horizontal" rigging
-- porty attached to a trailer hitch and used to hold a rope in a more horizontal orientation.

This makes me wonder if a port a wrap would make a good "progress capture" device in a 2:1 or 3:1 tree pulling scenario.

As it stands, the only "progress capture" I do -- if pulling on a rope by hand -- is pull it tight, then walk around the tree a couple of times before tying it off.

Would a port-a-wrap be good for this?

Or is there a more preferred way of maintaining the tension in a pull rope other than walk around the tree and tying it off?

Thanks a lot.



There is a farm tractor in one of the pictures of the tree you lost to side lean that took out a telephone pole and transformer... Porty is a convenient way to attach line to a vehicle for use in pulling or pre-tensioning a pull line. i had a d-ring welded to the bucket of the skid loader just so we can easily attach a porty to the loader. Generally when just pulling trees (not using the loader as a ground anchor to lower limbs with) we will just tie the rope to the round bar of the grapple bucket. Takes longer to tie than to use a porty, but still only get the porty attached when there are a lot of trees getting pulled, as its not worth putting on and taking off the porty for just a few trees...

If you could have attached the porty to the tractor from that job, you would have had a reliable way to attach a pull rope and had a lot more pulling power at your disposal, which probably would have made the difference on that job..
 
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  • #31
Thanks Stig, Sean, Mellow, Butch, Stumpshot........

That's sort of like asking if the kid working at the oil change place should buy a Snap On torque wrench.
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Just F.Y.I. I still don't own a port-a-wrap to this day. In the rare situation where I need to secure a pull line such as in your question, I just take trunk wraps and tie it off. Easy peasy and no need to drag out another $140 chunk of metal so it can get lost.

ha, Brian, that was just what I was wondering about :)

But assuming a "horizontal" pull... pulling a victim tree, and tying off to an anchor tree --
-- isn't taking trunk wraps around the *anchor* tree ---
-- i.e.. to capture the tension of your rope on the victim tree ---

-- isn't that awkward and potentially dangerous?

.... pulling tight on the pull line....
walking around the anchor tree a couple of times while keeping the rope tight,
then walking around again to make sure it stays tight,
then tying some sort of knot in it.........

..and then if you need to get more tension in the line.....
you have to walk round and around the anchor tree again and unwind your rope....
.... pull it some more to get more tension....
.... then walk it back round and around the anchor tree, etc., etc.

Isn't the idea of a POW -- for horizontal pulling -- that one can tighten, lock tension, re-tighten, lock tension, etc., etc.
--- "easily" -- while standing in the same spot?


am I missing something? thx.
 
Gadgets are not a substitute for skills. Develop your skills, starting with the fundamentals, then add tools to make the job easier and more efficient.
 
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  • #33
Thanks, Mellow, great point.

... haven't finished reading the rest of the posts yet...
.... but is what I described the generally accepted way of tightening a pull rope to an anchor tree?
.... i.e. just walking it around and around?

thx.
 
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  • #34
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Playing with power, stay deep in power band at all times, never close to redline on any tool, rating or strategy.
Always some ready pocket to pull something out for more goody, constantly monitoring to catch the slightest problem before escalates. Like being in the wrong bar, always knowing which way to immediately this to if s goes wrong...

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^^^
Sounds good, Kenny.

But THANKS FOR CHECKING OUT MY WEBSITE --- and anyone else who has any comments, advice, criticism, etc. :)

.... yeah, I've really been thinking about the stump grinding aspect.... along with thinking about finding somebody to work with...

.... great advice on the trailer.... similar to Sean's advice a while back...
... so far the best I've done is to lay long rope(s) across the trailer bed to start with.... followed by some round-ish branches for rollers
... then stack brush on top of that...tie the load like a cinched up Christmas tree with the initial rope.
---- then when unloading, connect said rope to a (e.g.) tree and pull the trailer out from under the load.

....haven't gotten to the post where you describe the rat's tail yet per Jonny's question.


Thanks DMc -- sounds good!

Kevin, is that the SRT climbing device you invented? ...... so it is suitable for rigging as well? ..... 13mm line or less? thanks.

Thanks CurSedVoyce. I also appreciate Brian's straight forward comments.

Thanks Murphy -- yeah that tractor wasn't available at the time.... no driver.

EDIT: Kenny, Cool stuff about the mariners, sailing, rigging, -- rat tail -- etc.
........ but in this simple application --- progress capture of a "horizontal" pull line.......... would *any* kind of friction hitch work?
-- i.e. that would allow pull in one direction but hold the tension when pulling stopped.
 
That is a dedicated rigging device based off of the rope wrench. It allows you to pull and then it takes friction on release. This is nice for speed lining because one person can just pull the line tight and hold it tight as the branch comes down the line. When its in front of thw chipper you let the slack into it. I usually use it as a in tree friction device. Allows me to tip tie things more and allows the g roundies some lift whereas the portawrap cannot be tensioned once its wrapped up
 
You missed it then, he put up a pic describing the rat tail. It's a friction hitch that has been around for centuries I think. I had just never heard of it.
*Edit* nevermind, you got it :)
 
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Thanks MB, Jonny...........

but question still remains, please...... if using trunk wraps on the anchor tree to hold the line...... is the normal/approved method of tightening and wrapping to pull rope tight, then walk around tree a couple of times... keeping rope tight.... then tie a knot to hold it in place?
.......... then if you need to RE-tighten you untie the knot .... UN-wind the rope around the tree, walking around the opposite direction... re-tighten the rope and repeat wraps, etc. ?

That's the way I am currently doing it..... but it seems very awkward.... like there must be a better, safer way.
 
How about a webbing anchor and a 3-1 with a prusik/prusik minding pulley. Capture progress, don’t screw up anchor tree, and mechanical advantage. And you can pull it off yourself.
 
Porty is very good for what you want but expensive option.
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Porty and trunk wraps are for brake force,
Any Friction hitch strategy can snub remaining forces after brake force buffers to usable range, person could do same in their power band.
But brake concept and friction hitch different devices on single line like this generally.
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Can do a 90 degree or more around main anchor to take brunt of proposed loading, trailing rope to then smaller trees to walk around and lock line off on. Or after 90 or more on main anchor to Muenter on other anchor folding back so can pull thru Muenter and feed into at same time. Easy to lock off Muenter to krab or small tree .
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Anyway can segment system, drop forces to more manageable , to secure at easier to walk around or other wise more manageable position. Massive tree is for anchor, brake force tho in amount of rope half circles, friction path increase is nominal increase compared to competing half circles clamping. Thus 3 full wraps on small smooth Porty about same as ,3 on medium ruff tree, generally too much!
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Now, is possible to have a friction hitch with tender set up on opposite side of pulley from truck pull, so truck pulls friction hitch into pulley, but tender stops it first(even used padlock for friction tender stop before pulley one time on existing system in a pinch). But if truck backs up friction hitch holds etc. But 1000# is about all i'd want to put on that w/o friction hitch heat causing problems if slipped. You are talking about being at the edge of that if not stepping over, but can give some safety range. Prussic type preferred, , want tighter to dent grabbed line so look for tighter cord and smaller for tighter per square inch and smaller knife to dent into grabbed host line more. 2 leg prussic grabbing 1 leg line can be smaller/weaker and still as strong!
 
Robert, how are you tensioning? The simplest one rope, puller/ progress capture device is the Maasdam CRP with the standing end of the rope being used to choke an anchor tree and provide a connection for the hook. The working end is attached to the tree with a canopy anchor point or base-tie.

It's really that simple. Are you having to pull a tree, and them release it before it is on the ground, and can have branches/ trunks cut free, if needed?








You can work a MCRP backward, slowly, if needed, for some reason, such as giving out a bit of rope to slack a knot for untying, FWIW, in case you didn't know.
 
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Thanks Kenny, Sean.....

Kenny are you saying 1000# holding force is the most you would trust to a prussic? (I need to investigate the Muenter hitch)
... that also makes sense about using a (e.g.) 90* turn on a big tree but actually tying it off on a smaller tree that is easier to wrap around.

Sean, yes, I see exactly what you are saying with the MCRP.... simple and effective.

... I guess I am thinking past that, as a contingency/emergency/backup plan --- in case the MCRP wasn't enough.

I am trying to figure out a simple/repeatable system for setting up an MA rigging -- by hand, MCRP, and/or truck.

Here is what I'm trying to get my head around: ... order of planning and/or escalation

1. pull rope by hand
2. pull rope by hand with MA
3. pull rope by MCRP
4. pull rope by MCRP with MA
5. pull rope with truck (e.g. with redirect)
6. pull rope with truck and MA

I guess I'm trying to figure out and standardize a plan for each of the above cases so I won't have to figure it out when the time comes.

One of my motivations for thinking this through are memories of pulling a pull line and awkwardly wrapping it round and round a big anchor tree.... trying to keep it tight while I tie some kind of knot .......... very awkward ..... ALONG WITH .... memory of the pecan tree fiasco .... trying to standardize a better way.
 
Mate, just don't take on any jobs where you are fretting like this...start with the small ones, ones you can try your systems on without dire life threatening consequences.
Build on basics (Mick said that somewhere)
 
I totally agree with the last two posts. You are not being honest with yourself and certainly not with your clients. All the good advice you have been given will do you no good if you lack the ability to evaluate what you are capable of. This is not a game of, I think I can. You need more experience and the smart way to get that is by working your way up slowly. Keep asking questions but you need to be building knowledge and skill upon work you have done not what others have done.
 
Thanks Kenny, Sean.....

Kenny are you saying 1000# holding force is the most you would trust to a prussic?



I guess I'm trying to figure out and standardize a plan for each of the above cases so I won't have to figure it out when the time comes.


Prussic 1000#:>>try to stay under, not really a hard line, severe consideration otherwise;
>>don't like the hard clamp of Gibbs/cam over this load tho
>>FYI after years of experimentation, the arc for rope cams turns out to be a Natural occurring one of course: Nautilus shell arc!
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Actually i think want many plans, having played with tools as went along.
>>know what takes what to deploy, motions polished, best way to store to that end. Know time investment over pulling by hand etc.
>>polished moves like a gunfighter draws the right pistol, from right place and shoots target clean.
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Truck is going to depend on access to good ground, but is most powerful, lowest human effort.
MA needs an anchor ( i think of as an electrical ground connection) , as does MCRP to invoke more force (leveraging amplitude from the electrical ground connection).
Kit needs many tools and strategies, in smallest space of war vehicle
>>job needs them deployed productively for what ground and anchor points it presents.
>>master chessman has many moves; but chooses correctly for cleanest action by what is on the board!
 
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Thanks everyone.... ha, but if I listened to some of you I think I would give up now! :)

Reminds me of the story of the guy who asked Mozart's advice how to begin writing music
Mozart said go to university and study music for 4 years.
The guy said -- yes, but you didn't do that, you just started writing music at age 3.
replied Mozart: "But I never asked anyone's advice"
 
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