How is this Rigging Configuration for Pulling a Tree?

rfwoody

Treehouser
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North Mississippi
Does this look like a reasonable, relatively safe rigging configuration?

....any "red flags" (or yellow) or questionable/bad practices?

Thanks for ANY and ALL critiques, rebukes, scorn, comments, suggestions, etc.!

Treehouse_Treehouse_TAYLOR_REDIRECT_PULLEY_1_20180905_102428_reduced_for_Treehouse_upload_2.jpg
To stay out of the rigging "line of fire" I want to work the Masdaam from *inside* the angle of rigging, correct?


Treehouse_Treehouse_TAYLOR_REDIRECT_PULLEY_2_20180905_102326_reduced_for_Treehouse_upload_2.jpg
Modified Masdaam using Patrick (EducatedClimber) method, replacing (cheap?) hook with carabiner,
and connected to trailer hitch with clevis shackle.


Treehouse_Treehouse_TAYLOR_REDIRECT_PULLEY_3_20180905_102335_reduced_for_Treehouse_upload_2.jpg
Again, Patrick's modification using 25' rope with Masdaam and prussik cord at the end to grab the rigging line.
(I am planning to replace the bowline (or is it a fisherman's knot?) with a spliced eye)


Treehouse_Treehouse_TAYLOR_REDIRECT_PULLEY_4_20180905_102348_reduced_for_Treehouse_upload_2.jpg
approx 90 deg. angle from truck to tree.
Note flat anchor rope configuration (Cosine near 0! (per Kenny/TreeSpyder)) ... should have had more of a "beak" putting Cosine closer to 1!


Treehouse_Treehouse_TAYLOR_REDIRECT_PULLEY_4B_20180905_102437_reduced_for_Treehouse_upload_2.jpg
Another shot looking toward object tree.
You can see my first attempt at a spliced eye, with 8 or so braids.

Treehouse_Treehouse_TAYLOR_REDIRECT_PULLEY_5_20180905_102519_reduced_for_Treehouse_upload_2.jpg
Looking toward direction of lay.... I guess I overdid the wraps for the pull line.
White Oak, 19" x 70'


Treehouse_Treehouse_TAYLOR_REDIRECT_PULLEY_6_20180905_103823_reduced_for_Treehouse_upload_2.jpg
Very bad hinge.
I cut the notch from the other side (right side looking toward lay)... and it was about 3" (or more) off level.
The back cut I made from the left side and had a few false starts because I wasn't allowing for the far side being 3" higher than the near side of the notch.
Also you see I cut through the far side of the hinge, making a triangle.
The good thing was I was making the back cut on the good side of the tree... and the thick part of the hinge was opposite the lean.


Treehouse_Treehouse_TAYLOR_REDIRECT_PULLEY_7_20180905_103952_reduced_for_Treehouse_upload_2.jpg
I failed to account for the right lean of the tree when sighting/judging the intended lay.... so I missed where I wanted to go by about 6' to right of log there out front


Treehouse_Treehouse_TAYLOR_REDIRECT_PULLEY_9_20180905_104036_reduced_for_Treehouse_upload_2.jpg
Final shot looking back toward the stump... tree should have been pointing more toward the right - toward camera.
Tree might have done fine without the pull line.
Only tension in line was what I manually pulled through Masdaam to start off.

Thanks for ANY and ALL critiques, rebukes, scorn, comments, suggestions, etc.!
 
Personally I wouldn't use aluminum carabiners for rigging or pulling.
 
Hi Robert, couple changes I would make. First, yes, steel biners for rigging. Second, and more importantly, I would have taken the pull line through the redirect block, and then joined onto it with the Maasdam rope. If you ever found yourself in a situation where you needed more pull, but the line couldn't go through a redirect, then you would be stuck. So whenever you are joining lines together, make sure they join on the side of the block that allows for more pull, rather than less. Hope that makes sense. I still need to email you my quote sheets that you asked about, don't let me forget... Peace.

Patrick
 
Over-complicating the rigging and screwing the important part---face-cut/ backcut/ hinge, which can be easily corrected if marked out and checked BEFORE you paint yourself into a corner.
Basically, what you did, in my opinion, was getting into critical situation (lost control) for lack of an easy to execute plan, cut the face-cut and back-cut correctly. Not rocket science. Easy to see when the cut is not going where it is supposed to go, if you don't let go of the plan and judgment.


Its said a person can pull their own weight.
(let's ignore weight being gravitational force, and measuring in kilonewtons, etc)
A 200 pound person will be able to pull 200 pounds of tension on a rope. The sheave is about 2" radius. The handle is about 16" radius at the grip. This means you get about 8 times MA, roughly. A 175 pound person might be getting up to 1500 pounds of tension.


When younger and stronger, I've pulled awfully hard to skid some logs without issue (from behind a plywood shield).


MCRPullers are made for three-strand.
Why would you think that the hook is the weak link?



I would:
- take the standing-end of the pull-rope
-pass through guide-eye on rope puller and install around sheave
-pull some slack through
-use standing-end for a running bowline to anchor to tree
-tape latch open on hook of puller latch will catch on rope.
-girth-hitch hook to anchor-end of the rope at a good working position. Load-strand toward spine of hook .
-pull slack through the Rope-puller against the hook/ anchor.
-tension with one-hand. If your rope is in good shape, you are going to be hard-pressed to break it. A young buck would be hard pressed to break it. Give it about 4 out of 10, 10 being your hardest one-hand pull. Being older, consider a two-hand pull, but not all you've got.

Install rope using throwline to get a base-tie----KISS running bowline.

One throw line and weight, one rope, one rope puller, no lightweight truck sliding because of poor traction (wet grass/ slope/ gravel).



Mark out your cut on the trunk.
Front of hinge, and back of hinge.

Use this as a guide.
Always keep checking the gunning sight on the saw as you are establishing the hinge, looking as far as possibly/ reasonable in the distance down your gunning sight. If you marked the hinge right in the first place, cut to the front of hinge mark. If not, DON'T! Re-mark your hinge if necessary, or use the original mark as a guide, as necessary.

Once you're hinge is correct on the front side, decide with good judgment if you need to remark the rear of the hinge. This is not a race. No need to short-cut steps.

People get excited about cutting, heart racing, frustration building if not hitting the face-cut right, etc, etc, and judgment goes out the window. Too often, people are hot on the throttle, and didn't bring the wood glue for when they overcut. They are in the heat of the moment trying to judge their hinge location and thickness, rather than working with some pre-planned marks.

Clearly, when there are other indications that your plan is not going to work, like the tree starts to fall, don't stay around to try to make sure your hinge is cut up to some line.


If you are not cutting to the marks STOP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
STOP!!!!!!!!!!!
CHECK EARLY AND OFTEN.
The saw always cuts in one plane if sharpened properly.
It will continue to cut as long as the operator tells the machine to cut.



Looks like you started your cut and didn't check it. Looks like you were too far around the side of the tree, rather than farther out front a bit. How could you miss that your bar was drooping that much?????????? For real!



If you screw the pooch on direction, and can't save the face-cut, you can go up or down the trunk about 1.5-2 diameters of the tree. Beware based on species. Aim to change the direction a fair bit on a straight-grained tree that might split down/ up easily, from the first face-cut to the second.


When you can, stand the tree on wedges a bit, finish your back-cut. Set you wedges some more, then pull it over. As possible, keep the wedges tight. You can re-direct the rope from the anchor tree back to the felling tree area, so you're not running out in front, back and forth. If your anchors line up right, you can pull from the stump while working the back-cut to keep tension up, if it starts to move forward.


Shaving the bark off the hinge will allow you to watch the wood, and see vertical splits starting. Too thick of a hinge, compensated for by lots of power can split trees.


Measure and mark twice, cut once.
 
I would have loaded weight in truck and used it to pull, on good ground with run and gas available, maybe even a 2:1 of truck against tree.
>>If just using truck as anchor might have weight loaded in truck, chock rears and turn fronts so if took a creep backwards would arc away from target tree so rope stays tight as possible.
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Wedge for sawyer to tap as anti sitback in case any probs., especially in truck pull for any doubters.
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Red pulley anchor to tree,:
>>I'd weaken by taking 1 rope turn out of carabinier and let seat to tree>> will give more grip for next move
>>but then make MUCH stronger by allowing more line into turns so pulley spaces farther from tree, this leverages those 2 turns much less than 3 turns pulled ACROSS / NOT WITH ROPE COLUMN that are leveraging against rope strength so hard. The flatter line is to tree, the more leveraged against rope, so give more 'teepee' so legs of support are straighter, just like if 4 wooden table legs, straight, pure inline is max architecture, greater angles weaken, leveraging against support structure/ legs.
>>any knots, ruff rope sections should be 'hidden' on trunk from rawest forces of pull/ not part of pristine rope sections of direct support taking rawest forces.
.
I like low redirect pulley even on straight run to keep more rotational angle on tree as truck pulls forward AND not to lift up more and more on back of truck for less traction as pull forward ( without lower redirect pulley)
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Facing deeper in would undermine CoG more and place hinge at wider trunk area so more side to side control against sideLean and wind sail, and thinner, more flexible forward flex unless center punch face.
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I assume.... proper framework to hitch receiver underneath, but still favour pulling directly from truck frame i-beam, always have screwlink thru hole in my frame (if no tow hook inline) and simply rope to link , if any metal link in line past bumper line try to allow low radius in case of overload/recoil.
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Seems like earlier face close was pushing towards tension stretched fibers >>correct as an force examination but still not a target practice.
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I.m kinda belts and suspenders on rigs and would even put quick slipped stopper after friction hitch.
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I like polishing everything right to these models, even if overkill, as long as smooth even workflow practices.
But also, so eye only sees things groomed to such alignments, so things look out of place if not!!
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I like back tie up over top on target tree, but think will find easier if playing this backwards knot ends up facing sky rite in front of sawyer and only 2turns to undo before pull rope out of way before bucking, as soon as under turns can slow pull rope out with truck, even if maasdaam pull but would rote pull around maasdam even if left in place.
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2 Turns like Double Bearing of Cow rather than Single Bearing of Timber
>>please imagine lengthwise pull ( upward) as worst errant angle of pull and 1Turn wrap as hinge lending towards upward pull enough to invite creep especially on taper. But 2nd Turn as a stop of the upward hinge allowance just like 1st nail in board allows hinge rotation , 2nd nail locking pin stops hinge .
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But all in all you brought the bear down, and walked away, that is a good day!
 
Maasdam as it is has always pulled it's weight, no issues. I prefer screw shackles for rigging. At least 2 ton WLL is nice. I like simple, straight forward setups.
 
I don't think there's a bit I can add to Sean's first post...very comprehensive, much in line with my own thinking, most especially his first paragraph.

My word, Robert...if you can't make a felling cut any better than that, you need to find another avenue for your energy. That one sucks the hairiest of moose lips, bro :). More to the point, you are on the cusp of breaking valuable infrastructure or hurting, maybe killing, someone or yourself.

Others have made valuable points for you to take to heart. But that stuff is all around the edges, frankly. I know I'm coming on pretty strongly, but you need to hear this, my friend. You are not up to this game in skills, yet. Not by a long shot. And I say this with only your welfare, and that of those around you, in mind.

It's been said many a time, by me and by others...the hinge directs the tree to the lay...nothing else, short of a rocket propelled skid steer ala Mr. Murphy :D, can make a pull line direct a tree.
 
Sean, this setup for the Maasdam is from a YouTube video I made a while back. I rig it with a 25 ft long 3-strand rope that stays on the puller, then join it to the pull line with an eye to eye. Exactly the same as a 5 to 1. Just the way I prefer to set it up. Yes, you could use the Maasdam with just a single long rope, tied to the tree and run through the puller.

Looking at the pictures again, I see that Bob did have the ropes joined on the right side of the redirect, so, my bad on the earlier comment.

As far as the cutting skills go, I think we have all seen far worse stumps. This looks like a non-critical situation to me from the pictures, so good on you Bob for using it to practice your rigging and cutting skills. You have to flop a lot of trees before you ever get better at it...

Patrick
 
I agree with Sean, Burnham, and Mick. Always choose the simplest solution/option. Especially when you are still trying to learn. Your cutting and understanding of it are what you need the most work on. It is the foundation for all the rest.
 
Interesting to me to read at least two different, very comprehensive, approaches to the same situation and then other various suggestions too. The phrase, more than one way to skin a cat comes to mind.

And even the counsel to come up with another vise/pastime to kill yourself. Lots of ways to kill oneself. :) Looks like your having fun Bob.
 
Cutting a good face takes patience, judgment, and time. Cutting a good face-cut like its easy, making people think that there is nothing to it, takes skill and experience on top of judgment and patience.


That was the time to learn to wedge a tree, when there is a pull rope, and an open lay, done with a Good face-cut. The back-cut seemed perpendicular to the grain, like one would often/ typically want, but it was out of alignment, with the hinge that was cut off. The rigging was super-over complicated. I think Robert was talking very ambiguously about working "inside" the 'bite' as correct.

I don't really understand Kenny's cosine this and that, but I do understand vector forces, wood grain, hinges, wedging trees, etc pretty well.

What the F do we need Cosine this and that for a basic pull-over. Overcomplicating the whole situation, IMO.



It was New Guy-YouTube video Tree Service 101, no offense intended.
Look at Human's videos. That guy should be dead so many times over, but he's doing product reviews, etc, etc.


My late friend with the under-the-table tree service in podunk, Midwest USA used to tell people that they don't want to hire the cheapest guy in town. Why? Because he used to be the cheapest, least experienced guy in town, and he knows how that goes. "I used to be that guy." He had his own suture kit, got tickled by primaries more than once, didn't understand rigging, had 70 emergency responders for the fire when he put a 28" tree on the primaries, cut shin muscles from stumping without a wedge or technique, with an ms660.

Robert, you don't want to be that guy. BTW, at his starting point in treework, he had lots of experience in hard rock climbing, was young, and rebounded from injuries relatively quickly.
 
Look at Human's videos. That guy should be dead so many times over, but he's doing product reviews, etc, etc.
Personally, I try not to look at Human's videos. I've watched a good handful of them, trying to understand what the attraction is (25K subscribers and all that...), either for him or the other Buckin' fella. I just can't jibe with all the elementary rigging mistakes, broken tie in point, almost killing himself on camera multiple times. To err is Human, I suppose. The real deal-breaker for me, though, is the amount of swearing on camera -- if I'm going to watch a tree cutting or technique video, I want to be assured that the person knows what they're doing (so we don't get into a blind-leading-the-blind scenario) and that if my children walk in while I'm watching, they won't be facing the queen F word every few sentences. For that, I salute our most August friend who creates good clean entertainment of the tree kind! Safe for families and children of all ages...
 
I don't like very much the way which the carabiner holds the maasdam's boddy. The biner doesn't sit on the transversal pin like the original hook, but hangs between the recessed sides of the link. That tends to spread apart the sides with a huge force and that's never good.

The side lean of the tree isn't responsible of the target miss, but your tilted hinge is.
From the pics, the sidelean doesn't seem monstrous and your hinge appears correctly aimed (the middle of the log in front). If you did cut it well leveled, the tree would have fallen short off your target's right, by about the amount of the side lean. Here, you got much more than that because the rotational axis was tilted toward the wrong side, so the trajectory plan followed it to the right.
Try to visualize that by moving your head, miming the tree's path :
- head straight, look in front of you, move your head down like "yes". Now you see just between your feet. Like an usual tree fall.
- tilt your head sideway toward the left (like your jaw is your bad hinge). Then, the yes move, keeping your hears were they are. Now your sight is frankly toward the right. The tree followed that, regardless of its lean.
Actually, I use this to plane my cut if I have to fight a side lean or if I want to rotate an upward limb or a whole tree. For your tree, I would have tilted slightly the hinge the other way to get the tree on the log.
 
As Burnham states need to get more careful with saw>> kinda kept ignoring that but probably best advice...
Take time and care, respect you are carefully carving out a machine to trust 1 time to usher tree on thin flap of wood.
i don't try to direct with pull line,but rather use pull line (and/or wedge) to force meatier hinge >> then let it usher load more powerfully.
>>i i think pulling against sideLean doesn't force hinge to build muscles for this, pull to target lay,force stronger hinge, don't baby system weaker by temp offset side pull as hinge strength is being forged right before she starts to fold!!!!
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Need to machine faces flat like engineer, concentrate on flat saw ,even if need to use saw for shallow 'chalk line' as guide.once get perfectly flat line started
>>extend that line with guide bar by keeping 1/2 saw in kerf other half extending kerf >> force it to geometrically work by outsmarting.
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Some stuff you gotta do and do and find personal weak points to forge stronger, everyone Naturally does some right/some wrong as each is his own savant!
>>depends how field own ball from there!
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i'd pull with truck not rest of toys /also helps to keep minimal links in chain, straight from frame; on good dry ground, weight in back of truck, good tires, with plenty of gas, etc. Truck is onsite mule: transpo, gear, lifting, dragging,pulling etc. you have enough tools only imagination limits how much back breaking work can sluff off onto mule
Rope Math:
Single line reeved thru pulley to load/truck is not closed legs/parallel, therefore will not put 2x line tension on anchor support tree
>>But,then in all fairness it couldn't provide 2xline strength as support.
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Just as a 1000mm stick could not reach full 1000mm height at an angle
>>1000# line tension can't provide full upward lift at angle.
In fact if both were at 30 degrees deflection, the 1000mm board would reach 866mm and the 1000 rope tension would provide 866# upward lift
>>Same potential: 1000 x same cosine:.866 gives each answer ...
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Sometimes helps to think of rope pull angles as more familiar table legs:
table-legs-model-for-tension-or-compression.png
 
As far as the cutting skills go, I think we have all seen far worse stumps. This looks like a non-critical situation to me from the pictures, so good on you Bob for using it to practice your rigging and cutting skills. You have to flop a lot of trees before you ever get better at it...

Patrick

While I agree that this was a non-critical (hard to mess up) scenario which is a good place to learn from your mistakes, I would hope that he can learn a lot from the comments here and improve his falling technique immediately..

It's great that he can come to this place and put his work out for criticism and get so many responses... I feel the love and its awesome!

Here's mine... Cutting trees in the woods is much much much more dangerous than suburban falling in open lawn, so while you could get yourself killed in the woods as suggested, you stand a good chance of upping your game before you get into regretaable scenarios as long as you stay with the easy (straight) trees, in open areas...

IN the end you need to understand why you are doing what you are doing.. if you wanted to practice using the system per Patrick's videos, then fine, all that hardware and the prussic was was way overkll and needlessly complicting a fairly simple task...

WHY put the tree rope in the tree????

To get the tree to commit to the lay once the hinge has been properly formed....

I love a good redirect , and from my perspective the rope puller was completely unneeded... Set rope, tie rope to truck, make cut to form proper hinge. Walk to truck (staying out of the drop zone), start truck and step on the gas (lightly)....

As far as the cut goes... try this


Make top (angled) cut of traditional or open face first.. When you finish, make sure the bar is parallel to the ground (hopefully your bar is long enough to poke through the far side, so you can see the tip...... once the top cut is made, gun checked and level checked, simply start your flat cut at the exact lowest part of the top cut's kerf, and keep the bar LEVEL as you carefully cut, watching the tip, to make sure it doesn't bypass the top cut. The two cuts should meet if your saw is cutting straight.. Go find some tall stumps, or stand a heavy log up and practice to you have it down.... cut 30-40 notches while focusing on the above, before you fall your next tree.....

then, when you do drop your next tree make sure your bar is level when starting the back cut, and send us more pics


Good Luck
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #18
Personally I wouldn't use aluminum carabiners for rigging or pulling.

Stig, thanks. point taken!

====================

Hi Robert, couple changes I would make. First, yes, steel biners for rigging. Second, and more importantly, I would have taken the pull line through the redirect block, and then joined onto it with the Maasdam rope. If you ever found yourself in a situation where you needed more pull, but the line couldn't go through a redirect, then you would be stuck. So whenever you are joining lines together, make sure they join on the side of the block that allows for more pull, rather than less. Hope that makes sense. I still need to email you my quote sheets that you asked about, don't let me forget... Peace.

Patrick

Patrick, thanks for taking another look and seeing my pull line was through the redirect block -- ha, I was getting confused :)

.... and thanks! ... yes, sir, I will remind you.... Actually I downloaded your quote sheet.... I was just wondering if you filled these out online (e.g. with editable PDF) or just print them off blank and fill them out by hand. Thanks!


====================

Sean,

You have been (I think) the most detailed and practical help to me on this site. (still haven't forgotten the white rattle cans to touch up my truck with).
And I know you have seen a lot so your warnings/advice make an impact.

People get excited about cutting, heart racing, frustration building if not hitting the face-cut right, etc, etc, and judgment goes out the window. Too often, people are hot on the throttle, and didn't bring the wood glue for when they overcut. They are in the heat of the moment trying to judge their hinge location and thickness, rather than working with some pre-planned marks.

That was me exactly here. And I started off intending to be very careful and methodical.

I'm going to print off this whole thread and keep it as a reminder... especially your comments/advice/warnings in this post and your later post.

=====================

Kenny,

Thanks for taking the time to reply with all the detail.
I have always liked/loved/admired math and physics and the way they work together (Newtonian/mechanical physics?) ... so I feel like I almost begin to understand where you are coming from.

I've read through both your posts a couple of times, but plan to read/study them again along with the other posts people have been kind enough to post in this thread.
.... I have a question about the 2nd one I'll ask at the end if you see it later and have time to answer.

=====================

Maasdam as it is has always pulled it's weight, no issues. I prefer screw shackles for rigging. At least 2 ton WLL is nice. I like simple, straight forward setups.

Thanks Peter, for your validation of Maasdam and screw shackles.

====================

I don't think there's a bit I can add to Sean's first post...very comprehensive, much in line with my own thinking, most especially his first paragraph.

My word, Robert...if you can't make a felling cut any better than that, you need to find another avenue for your energy. That one sucks the hairiest of moose lips, bro :). More to the point, you are on the cusp of breaking valuable infrastructure or hurting, maybe killing, someone or yourself.

Others have made valuable points for you to take to heart. But that stuff is all around the edges, frankly. I know I'm coming on pretty strongly, but you need to hear this, my friend. You are not up to this game in skills, yet. Not by a long shot. And I say this with only your welfare, and that of those around you, in mind.

It's been said many a time, by me and by others...the hinge directs the tree to the lay...nothing else, short of a rocket propelled skid steer ala Mr. Murphy :D, can make a pull line direct a tree.

Mr. Burnham,

it is great for you to reply to my thread.

You have seen more than just about anyone here in The Treehouse, no doubt, so your words, especially of warning, should be, and are especially weighty.

So when I print out this thread, I will probably print your comments out by themselves and post them somewhere in my house and maybe in my shop and in my truck to be a reminder to me! Thanks a lot and best wishes, sir.

=====================

Use the truck, why bother with a little hand winch?

Mick,

Well taken, My thoughts are: more precise control; in this case just trying to prove the concept; and there may be a situation where I can't use the truck.

=====================

I agree with Sean, Burnham, and Mick. Always choose the simplest solution/option. Especially when you are still trying to learn. Your cutting and understanding of it are what you need the most work on. It is the foundation for all the rest.

Thanks DMc.

=====================

Interesting to me to read at least two different, very comprehensive, approaches to the same situation and then other various suggestions too. The phrase, more than one way to skin a cat comes to mind.

And even the counsel to come up with another vise/pastime to kill yourself. Lots of ways to kill oneself. :) Looks like your having fun Bob.

Thanks Merle

=====================

Cutting a good face takes patience, judgment, and time. Cutting a good face-cut like its easy, making people think that there is nothing to it, takes skill and experience on top of judgment and patience.
.....
It was New Guy-YouTube video Tree Service 101, no offense intended.

Sean, you are exactly right .... "New Guy-YouTube video Tree Service" ... I was thinking I could cut a face cut like August Hunicke, making it look easy (although I really was trying to be slow and exact and precise).

=========
=========

GP, great point... yeah I stopped watching those... but I do like watching Buckin' some. As I recall he is clean-mouthed... and August Hunicke likes him which starts me off liking him.

=========
=========

I don't like very much the way which the carabiner holds the maasdam's boddy. The biner doesn't sit on the transversal pin like the original hook, but hangs between the recessed sides of the link. That tends to spread apart the sides with a huge force and that's never good.

The side lean of the tree isn't responsible of the target miss, but your tilted hinge is.
From the pics, the sidelean doesn't seem monstrous and your hinge appears correctly aimed (the middle of the log in front). If you did cut it well leveled, the tree would have fallen short off your target's right, by about the amount of the side lean. Here, you got much more than that because the rotational axis was tilted toward the wrong side, so the trajectory plan followed it to the right.
Try to visualize that by moving your head, miming the tree's path :
- head straight, look in front of you, move your head down like "yes". Now you see just between your feet. Like an usual tree fall.
- tilt your head sideway toward the left (like your jaw is your bad hinge). Then, the yes move, keeping your hears were they are. Now your sight is frankly toward the right. The tree followed that, regardless of its lean.
Actually, I use this to plane my cut if I have to fight a side lean or if I want to rotate an upward limb or a whole tree. For your tree, I would have tilted slightly the hinge the other way to get the tree on the log.

Marc-Antoine,

nice observation about the Maasdam carabiner twisting/not seating. I saw that too (either before or after) and decided to figure out something else for next time.
Thanks for your careful analysis of the notch and lean.
I tried your head tilt technique here in my office and I plan to test it out in the field. Thanks.

=====================

Murphy,

Thanks for the post!
That is what I need to do is practice-practice-practice i.e. in "classroom" situation.
Will review your entire post after it is printed out.

=====================

EVERYONE........Thank you for the WARNINGS, SCORN/CRITICISM and ENCOURAGEMENTS ..... they sort of balance out but more like a pyramid with warnings as the foundation.

=====================

Kenny ===> if you see this, I have a question about your 2nd post, please -- the diagram. Thanks a lot for taking the time to create that.

Would you please explain where your get the "SWL" figure (Safe Working Load(?) .... 1/5 for rigging?) ... and what the "4k" means (4000?) and/or where it comes from? ..... with these explained I think I will 100% grasp what you are saying there. Thanks!

=====================

next step to print out this entire thread (so far) and make multiple copies of Mr. Burnham's (and others'?) warnings.
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #19
Not much more to say on this one.... but just to say I just ordered a couple of rigging carabiners.

And... Kenny/TreeSpyder, if you see this would you please explain the 2nd diagram

Would you please explain where your get the "SWL" figure (Safe Working Load(?) .... 1/5 for rigging?) ... and what the "4k" means (4000?) and/or where it comes from? ..... with these explained I think I will 100% grasp what you are saying there. Thanks!
 
As mentioned, practice face-cuts (and correcting face cuts) and back cuts on vertical logs.

I used to teach a good number of Americorps volunteers. After a day's instruction and demonstration, these people would practice a bit on high stumps, then go fell a tree with wedges.

Those with more potential and interest worked on forestry projects.

Little directional face cuts on limbs also can provide practice applying the principles even if a slice-through or drop-cut (compression, then tension snap cut released by gravity) would suffice.



Don't overthink the rattle can. Any color and finish of white paint will match a ton more than primer gray. Your return on investment will be high. You don't have to have great stuff, but I won't trust someone that can't afford or won't go to the trouble to rattle can the gray.
 
SWL is Safe Working Load as a ratio
>>manufactures will quote sometimes just 4k (yes 4000) or whatever and not state the ratio used clearly.
Different industries, risks etc. assert to use different ratios.
Would think in terms of 5x for dragging , 10x overhead lifting, 20x life support hardware etc.
Would always want to know full potential force, tensile and make own decision as this seems to be floating ratio etc. not consistent from manufacturer to manufacturer etc.
So for our purposes, 4x SWL ratio probably fair for dragging, but 2x SWL could be considered operating in the red...
.
In example given would say 4x more in safety standard than 2x for sure!
I picked 4k, 4000 as an example weight of 1ton tension on pulley has 4k potential, less with spread lines to pulley. Also chose 4k to make example work nicely of 4 legs greater than 6 that puts at risk in 2x SWL range.
.
Would look to l-earn to use bumper spikes as pivot and keep guide bar straight and enforce geometric logic to force face cuts to be crafted to meet precisely and not bypass. Bite pivot spike in and focus on flat guide bar rotating on pivot spike.
 
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....Don't overthink the rattle can. Any color and finish of white paint will match a ton more than primer gray. Your return on investment will be high. You don't have to have great stuff, but I won't trust someone that can't afford or won't go to the trouble to rattle can the gray.

Thanks a lot, Sean.

Just re-quoted the part about my truck..... FWIW .... that "gray" is not primer, but the steel truck body ... the white paint is peeling off.

so does that fact change your evaluation at all? ... not trying to be a smart a** but serious question.

Anyway, Thanks!
 
Step 1
wash truck,
2
go get white paint for $6,
3 shake,
4 spray without painting lights.

5. $5.99 and half an hour later, have a one-color truck. From 40', like when you pull up for the bid, it's one color and decent looking work truck.

Go crazy, get some sand paper, some primer, some masking tape, and you're up to $18, an hour of super easy work that will last longer and hold up better.


Go crazy, VistaPrint has magnetic door signs for $15+-.
 
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