Time for a new Silky. Fixed, straight. But which one?

Dengard

TreeHouser
Joined
Oct 30, 2015
Messages
9
Hello everybody, I have found you with a google search for straight blades vs curved ones, as a second result after the video of Silky Australia with that gorgeous woman.
I have tried a couple of curved blade saws and I cannot get used to them, I feel like I am using only the 50% of the blade and I cannot be much precise either.
After reading the thread of MasterBlaster I am convinced that I want a straight .
But at first let me tell you about me: I am not a tree climber, I am a gardener. So, although I was instructed how to fall a tree, I do not do much of that. I mostly cut some branches which are not needed, or which are dead or sick or whatever.
I have been fine with a Pocketboy 130 till now. But lately I have felt the need of something bigger, and fixed (as I would not carry it on me all the time).
I have read that many of you (specially MasterBlaser) love the Natanoko.
Is this because it is more robust due to the wider blade with slightly curved back?
May I suppose that this would be less important for pruning? I have the feeling that in most circumstances I need a less wide blade, something which can go better between the branches.
For this reason I like the "new" Tsurugi. I think a 300 with 10 teeth per 30mm would be good.

Any feedback?

I was also looking at the Gomtaro for Roots. In this moment I feel ok with Mattock or Minimattock, but if this Gomtaro special for roots is so good, I may give it a try. I just cannot stop thinking that beside soil there can be also some stone there. Would this saw resist that?

Thanks!
 
I have both the straight blade tsurugi AND the curved. They are both amazing tools. The curved is way better. Cuts faster. But if you don't want curved, then go with the 300 straight tsurugi.


love
nick
 
I too have the tsurugi and used to have the natanoko and gomtaro, tsurugi is def the way to go,gomtaro is good one too,they redesigned the natanoko to a version i do not like at all. Only thing is,do not get the large teeth cause you may find it harder to do finer pruning. Imo
 
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  • #7
What is the difference between Tsurugi and Gomtaro and Gomboy7 (which in my understanding is the exact same blade of the folding Gomboy) apart for the Gomtaro and Gomboy having apparently a bit wider blade (do you say wide, for the distance between teeth and back of the blade?).
I say "apparently", because I cannot find any official info anywhere about this. Only length and thickness are to be found.
Silky is pretty tricky with so many similar products...

As Reddog said, I like the needle blade of the Tsurugi, it can fit better between tight branches.
Would its blade be strong enough to cut 10-20cm wood? I may occasionally have to fall such small trees. Would the Tsurugi manage that?

Anyway there is a nice 280mm Gomtaro with teeth also on the back to make the undercut without turning the hand. Not a vitally essential feature, but nice to have.

About the Gomboy, I ask because I am thinking that a folding saw may have the advantage of a longer handle, and of the two positions the blade can be locked at.

So, if Gomboy and Gomtaro do not have much wider blade, and cut as well as the Tsurugi, I may have to think about which one to buy...

I agree on the Sawzall, but in this moment I cannot afford more than a Gomtaro, for roots.
I just wonder if a thin blade like Silky would not immediately bend when used in the soil.
If I need to dig out all the soil to have the roots 100% free, I better keep using the mattock.
 
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  • #8
Welcome to the TreeHouse, Dengard!

I prefer a curved blade...
Thanks!
What happened with your "never more a curved blade" decision?
Can you explain what made you change idea again?
When/why would a curved blade be better?
To me it seems that with a curved blade I need to move my wrist a lot, so that the curve of the blade follows the curve of the branch. In that case, yes, with one pull I can do a longer cut than with a straight blade.
It may be a matter of getting used, or, like the gorgeous Silky Australia woman says in that video, a matter of if one cuts mostly above the shoulders or not. But I do not feel comfortable with this movement which I need to make with the curved blade.

And also, how do you fall small trees (20cm diameter) with a curved blade? I mean, when/if you do not have or cannot/wont use a chainsaw. How can you with a curved blade be so precise not to cut pass the marks of the notching? (sorry, no idea about the right terminology in English...).
Besides, now that I think it better, with a curved saw you just can not do that kind of cut. That cut requires a straight saw.
Let me find a picture: http://www.bundesverein-wam.de/Regel/9_Massvorgaben_fuer_die_Faellung.gif
So, you make that thing on the front, called Fallkerb in German (I am not German but I am studying here). Then you mark the sides so you know where you do the final cut on the other side. This cut must end exactly at those two marks, so that the tree falls in the right direction, you know that. And it must have a straight line inside. A line which is parallel to the one of the "Fallkerb".
So, impossible with a curved blade, right?
 
I don't think many people will go to the trouble of falling 20 cm diameter trees with a hand saw. At least not professionals.

Your "Fallkerb" is called a facecut.
It doesn't have to be straight. the corners determinate the direction of fall.
Back in the axe and whipsaw days here, fallers would often make a slightly concave face cut.
A convex one is no good, since the middle will stick out farther than the corners and be the determining factor in where the tree falls.

Marking the sides is a rookie maneuver IMO. I let my apprentices do it at first, but quickly wean them of it.
 
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  • #11
I don't think many people will go to the trouble of falling 20 cm diameter trees with a hand saw. At least not professionals.

It depends on what you call "professional".
I am a professional. Just, gardener, not tree faller. So I do not own a chainsaw myself. And actually we do not have one where I work now (we mostly do perennials and pruning).
You are right anyway, I too would prefer chainsaw all the time, at least for big trees. But 20cm did not seem big to me. Although I admit I never did that with a handsaw.
Anyway, 20 or 15 is not the point. I just thought that once I have to buy a new handsaw I better buy one which eventually COULD do falling of small trees, if I ever find myself in the not-so-probable and surely not so usual situation of having to.
And, a curved saw would make a convex face cut... So, no way.

Of course, given that the 90 or more % of what I'll do is pruning, I would eventually buy a curved if I would be sure that it is much better than a straight, for my use.
So I would like to understand when is a curved or a straight better.
Is a matter of application? A matter of if you cut at shoulder height or above shoulder? A matter of "straight=more precise, curved=faster"? Or just a matter of being used to one or the other?

For roots you can also try an axe...

Yes, I use mattock or mini mattock now.
But the idea of a saw which is specially made for roots sounded nice.
It's not urgent anyway. For now I am mostly interested in a saw for pruning. But I may buy this Gomtaro too one day when I have the money.
If it works :)
 
Yes, I use mattock or mini mattock now.
But the idea of a saw which is specially made for roots sounded nice.
)

The axe will always cut roots more efficiently than the mattock. I wouldn't worry too much about whether the handsaw is specifically designed for roots or not, just pick any handsaw that seems to match the application and budget. I think the purpose of a curved blade is to create more downward pressure on the teeth - more important from a climbers perspective.
 
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  • #14
I think I had stupid biscuits for breakfast that day...

;)

Biscuits or "brownies"?
Ahi ahi ahi...
Anyway, you made a nice journey for a while with a straight blade, would you mind sharing some thoughts on what can a curved and what a straight do better?
I would also appreciate if you could consider the different needs that a not climber may have.
 
I reckon the curved cuts better cause as you pull it horizontally downward pressure on the teeth is generated by the curved shape, more important for a climber because it conserves energy, same would apply to a non climber but less critical
 
I prefer straight blade while climbing cause i can toss it back in the scabbard regardless of orientation.
 
A lot of 8"/ 20 cm trees are small enough that the curve of the hinge is probably insignificant. If you're really concerned, that's room enough to cut out the middle a bit with a sharp ax.
 
I use the Silky Sugoi 360. I also have used the Silky Zubat 300 a good bit. I personally prefer the larger blade of the Sugoi 360 and if you are planning on cutting larger stuff I would recommend to go pretty large. There is even the Silky Sugoi 420.
 
'kay...I use a Zubat 330 (curved) I've notched and hinged many fair sized branches and never had an issue with the notch, they always look fine to me, so whatever curve might be in there is insignificant.
However, lately I have been looking for a straighter or narrower blade for some of the pruning I do, mainly for fruit trees. The 'nub' on the tip of the Zubat, where there is a rounded bit with no teeth, can be a pain when trying to prune small tight branches, so yes, having another saw with a straight blade with teeth right to the tip is on my list as well.

I like the knife and fork analogy...you can eat with both, but soup is better with a spoon....

Only think about the Sugoi if you do a lot of larger diameter branches or small tree felling, the teeth are too coarse for fine pruning.
 
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  • #24
the video of Silky Australia with that gorgeous woman.

link please
Isn't she lovely?
If when a woman smiles you can't help smiling, she's something.

Now, about the saw, if she is right, I definitely need a straight saw, as that is how I mostly use a saw.
If she is not right, I guess I will have to find by myself when I will have the money.
You may gain back the investment of a saw within a day of work, but I am at my first job and mostly underpaid, and still have to save quite a lot of money for my latter studies.
For now I can afford just one.

MasterBlaster, if for better you mean faster, I get it, otherwise "better" is quite a relative concept.
I am confident that there would be no straight saws, if it would be true that the curved are just better.
Some people prefer the straight ones, and other people claim there are different application for each.

It is a bit frustrating that I cannot get a clear explanation of this.
I suppose I will stick with what I have read till now: the curved cut faster (although they do not offer a real speed advantage when cutting small branches, which is what I mostly cut), may be better when used quite above or below shoulder's level, are less precise and more difficult to control for fine pruning, due to their curve are more difficult to use between tight branches, and require a different way of moving the wrist which I am not used to.
Given that I do mostly small pruning and often between tight branches and am used to straight saws, I will go for the straight Tsurugi.
Hopefully some day I will understand the difference between straight and curved. From people, or personally.

Cheers and thanks for the help :)
 
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