Hardnose/Duromatic Chainsaw Bars

Bodean

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Any opinions on Rollamatic (sprocket tips) VS. Duromatic (hardnose tips).

We just bought a 47" stihl bar and noticed it's a hardnose tip, no sprocket.

What are the advantages and disadvantages of not having a sprocket tip?


Deva
 
It will get hotter and cause more chain stretch due to increased friction (especially with Stihl's anemic oilers of late). On the plus side you won't have to worry about blowing out a tip sprocket. I'd rather have the sprocket.
 
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Thing is the 41" bar has a sprocket while the 54" bar also has a sprocket tip.

Why hardnose on the 47"?
 
Sprocket is mo' betta... less friction, and it doesn't take as much poop to spin them.

The hardnosed bars are good for cuttin' in dirty wood or removing stumps. No sprocket in the tip to get all messed up with grit.

Gary
 
It will get hotter and cause more chain stretch due to increased friction (especially with Stihl's anemic oilers of late). On the plus side you won't have to worry about blowing out a tip sprocket. I'd rather have the sprocket.

Ditto.
 
My 2.

I think the differences in performance, say in terms of getting the job done in a specific time, are over rated. Chain stretch will pretty much bottom out after a time, and hard nose bars generally are supposed to run a looser chain anyway. Stihl hard nose bars are excellent bars.

Still, sprocket nose will give greater chain speed and be easier on the engine, so generally preferred I'd say, except when cutting in real dirty conditions, as Gary informs.

I have a hardnose bar that I use with carbide chain, if cutting around roots in the dirt. With the larger horsepower saws, I think there is even less difference using hardnose.

I wonder which would be preferred if you are doing a lot of plunge cuts?
 
Those who know how can run the hardnose bars. They last long, don't break much and are cheep.

I have run these a lot in the passed and still do at times.
It is not that bad but they are sencetive to chain tension.
It is important it is not tight or too loose.
I guess if you need a bar two times a year and get a bundle of cash for a job, it is a good choise. If you need it often I rather have a sprocket nose.
 
I'm really surprised to even hear that a top company like Sthil is manufacturing hardnose bars for their line of saws. Especially a long bar for a professional saw. That totally blows. I thought they would be above that.

xxxsadlknv;ouhb;ow
 
I have no love for the hardnose bars. Too much wear, too much friction, and the price is negligble at best!!
The only advantage is the abilty to use different pitch chain.
 
Hardnose on the shorter brushing saws (they wear out FAST in brush hard or sprocket) so cheaper for brushing in the long run.. Larger saws always sprocket and the oiling and wear is an issue for the longer bars. 25"-36". Anything smaller gets hard nose, even the arbor saws. I run Husky, Stihl and Echo for reference.
Larger saws and arbor saws only see tree work... No Brushing for them.. Brushing kills saws PERIOD.
 
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Stephen, can you be more specific when you say 'brushing'? What exactly is that? I'm not familiar with the term in the context you've used it.
 
Brushing. We clear bush for fire hazard. This includes many species that grow more as a shrub and make a ladder for burning when fires go through here. Ladder (if you can picture like a triangle) the upward slop if a line drawn from grass to brush to tree in an incline of height. Brushing is the removal of ladder fuels to the trees for fire protection. Manly protecting the trees and structures. Brush is more oft than not hard wood and also includes baby trees. Examples of brush would also include Manzanita (hard as nails and burns at 1200F) buck brush and deer brush (types of ceanosis also called calif lilac) mountain mahogany (also hard as steel), mountain cherry or red berry etc..
Most of these plants have many pinch points even at the stump and are VERY hard especially when dead and dry even harder. Imagine cutting dead live oak hardened by a year or two. Multiply by at least two and you have the brush we cut here. Hell on chain and bars.
 
I did treespacing when I was a younger fellow. Same sort of idea as what you're describing I think. Except it was to thin out stands to help them grow into merchantable timber faster. Sort of like eliminating competition to leave the top contenders. And hell on saws too.
 
Owning lot of antique saws I of course have a lot of hardnose bars including a 48" which as matter of fact is shown in my avatar . The older saws had better oilers ,plain and simple .The big Macs and Homies would lay on the oil for as long of bar as they are rated for ,just blow it off the end .The closest I've seen this is on is a Husqvarna 2100 but it isn't what a person would call a spring chicken .

You normally run with about 1/4 to 1/2 of the driver showing on the bottom sag of the chain on a hard nose .After you run one long enough you kind of get the hang of it .

I agree with B that the more modern saws are a tad bit too stingy with the oil for a long bar especially a hard nose .
 
Yes squishy... we do spacing also... competition is a problem with the overgrown woods we have here. Yup hard on the saws..
Trouble with brushing is that you have to run the chain tighter than when you do just trees... you are cutting at ground level horizontal with many different pinch points per cut. You don't over tighten the chain... but are pretty close to it. Wears ythe bars out quick. You also do a big no no regularly, lot of tip of bar cutting. Not necessarily in the kick back zone but pretty close. So your sprocket area wears FAST. I have bars that actually have a depression made from in the beginning of the sprocket area is... Just one side or other of the sprocket out side of the kick back zone. As you cut the brush we have here, it will pinch the bar regular, even at on leader at a time as opposed to a stump cut off. The brush is so tangled and bent in many directions it will pinch chain and bar on a lot of cuts. Coupled with the hardness of the wood, it makes for major wear. I can tell you of many a time where you will even see burn marks on the cut from fresh chain, heavy oil, etc. just because of the nature of the cut and the hardness of the wood. This is why we use the cheaper bars (hardnose) woodsman pro chain (round chisel) at 10.00 - 11.00 per loop, and husky throw aways (345 and 455 at 300 - 400 per as we toss them out after 3-4 years of service) for brushing... The Stihls only see tree work coupled with the huskys....
 
Cutting bamboo groves is also a major pita, and hard on saws. You wouldn't think so by looking at it, but the wood is very hard and stringy, and the hollow middle allows easy binding. It usually collapses before you get it cut all the way through, and often when you get it cut, it shoots off throwing splinters.

Just last week I was clearing some bamboo away from a pine removal site, and I loaned the 036 to another guy to help. Five minutes later he comes back and says the chain came off the bar....no biggee I thought, but somehow the locking ring on the sprocket and clutch cover had spanged off the driveshaft too. Never saw that before, but bamboo can twist up your bar and chain pretty good, and poke your eye out too.
 
Bamboo would be understandable as a bad to brush item. Yup hard as all get out when it drys, splintery, and the binding you owuld get from it.. And the splinters are sharp!.... Hurt like hell... Had a master gardener out here cleaning out his bamboo groves and got one clear through his hand.. No wonder they used bamboo for torture.
 
They grow certain species of bamboo here in the frozen tundra and it does pretty good considering . However the stuff is about like plumed grass and if you don't keep an eye on it that danged stuff would take over .
 
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