New employee experiment

I was thinking of hiring a brush monkey, working from the neck down. Low skill, low training, low pay, low expectations. A person to put branches into a machine, rake, and blow. I haven't had this before. Always trained guys to cut and rope, some climbing.

My new guy, who I've spent considerable time training for the time he's worked, has gotten a full time job with the State.

I'm tired of losing out on training for people who stay a short time.

I have trouble with people that can't follow directions. No directions besides feed chipper, rake rakings, blow off area. No expectations that they know anything about cutting, what a knot is called, etc.

It would be an occasional 'helper' position to compliment me climbing, Erik on the ground, and Iron.

Drug screen, back ground check, and they get themselves to and from every jobsite. I don't need them at my house/ shop.


I've conceived of downsizing considerably, having iron, and only taking on some jobs that I can do myself, or with occasional help. No plan to keep employees fully stocked on hours, etc. Probably not my best bet, but to be free of so many employee headaches would be great. it Won't build a business that can can then be run by a crew without me.


Thoughts.

I think you answered your own questions, sure, I have a handful of people who come from time to time, ranging from intelligent multilingual 20 something between jobs to thick as shit unemployed strong backed dimwit, pay em cash, keep em away from the client, as long as you have a presentable half decent ropeman most days it's all good.

I posted ads on Craigslist for employees. If it was to be a full time position, I could more likely, but unlikely find someone good via forums. Oly is not a hot destination spot to move to, as it happens.

One ad said EXPERIENCED Groundman/ woman, and told them that if they are experienced, they know about tree work, and will know what to tell me they can do, and what they won't do. I won't teach basics, but if they're experienced and sharp, there is lots of room for professional development.

The other ad was a little softer than need dum guy to be a brush b*tch. Stated occasional work, low responsibility, no cutting, roping, minimal training. A grunt.

IMO you need at least one good full time employee. Iron can do the rest, do you have a mini yet?? I roll out some pretty big take downs and only have 1 guy. I hate having employees too.

Ditto Paul. We bang out some work. People doubt us in the morning then shit when they come back for lunch i had a new guy start this spring. Helmet coms make ya think he knows what he's doing! Easy to teach with them. He's getting good!

One good groundman who would be better without the exertion saved by the upcoming mini.
At the moment I have a 9" x 16" V8 chuck and duck, which is actually great for this market, its fast to eat fir limbs fed by hand, faster than a feed-wheel, but don't know if I can feed with a BMG grapple or not.

Got one good ground man, and at times, even with self-lowering with natural crotches or Belay Spool, having two guys to land broad limbs in tight landscaped spots is better, though having a loader means tag-lines.

Someone to chip and rake would be good. Erik could be off bidding work while someone else does grunt work.
I would really like a climber to work with Erik on jobs without me, where both could do ground and climbing. I could work when I want, and as needed, with more flexibility and time spent with Dahlia.



This guy says he climbs and has experience, which is hard to find locally, IME.
Hi there,
Saw ur ad for work and interested in it, have plenty of years in the tree field, also a climber been doing it for years, done some work with a few companies around here, done my own thing so have references if needed, so please give call to 425-xxx-4640 , dustin is my name and located in west oly, thanks




Hello my name is Eric McLaglen from On Site Glass Solutions and More LLC. I am interested in your craigs list advertisement please respond for resume and experience 253-202-xxxx.

This one says automatic round file to me, if he doesn't give anything, and wants me to call him. That's all to typical. I know it was part preparation and part luck that I had my first CL general labor job within an hour of looking, and 12 hours of arriving in Olympia. I've done two tree jobs for that guy since, and a neighbor, and son-in-law. I guess that's why I"m not an employee.

Double ditto. One good ground guy and some iron, you can bang out a ton of work.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

A mini will feed any thing. If I run into a clean brush pile job, the mini brings it to the ground man and he sorts it out. A well trained groundsman is worth hi/her weight in gold. Get that mini.

I've wanted it for years. In light of recent developments with going back to full time business, and not having a worrying, road-blocking person to appease, I'm doing it. I'm 40 going into this season. I need a break.


I figured it would feed, just don't know how effectively.

I will likely move to more grapple truck disposal. A different guy from my friend with the usual knuckeboom grapple 16' flatbed, has a 30 yard end dump with a regular sit-on loader. I think he gets $350/ load. Probably worth it if its close to full loads. Problem is when its a load and a quarter. I could bring the chipper in for that, or just have to eat it, or get my regular friend's truck for the last of it.


Maybe I need to relax on my level of clean-up, too, but that's a hard one. Aim to please, and all that. I do really like a drop and leave job.

I basically climb part time (weekends and some afternoon jobs) and have been keeping it to jobs I can do myself, or with minimal help from the home owner. My idea was to get involved with a landscape company that does little tree work, but nothing major as it would be out of their abilities, that way, I'd have a couple of guys that work for the landscaper to do some minor ground work for me while I'm up in the tree..... yeah... much the same as looking for good help.... not gonna happen. (not to mention the problems with the landscape company owner).... Now mind you, if you had a job that involved smoke breaks and texting, there are plenty of candidates to fill that position!

Raj, have you seen the Belay Spool thread. A good piece of equipment for a solo operator, and any crew.

Actually no I haven't. I'll check it out, thanks!

Peter

Sean, what about looking for an older retired person. Not doing physical work everyday is a plus for them, and they can be on call. You can get a body with a mind as well, someone that wants to work. People here have already posted about older guys that they know that are a great asset, so it shows that it can work.

http://retirementjobs.com/jobs-over-50/jobs-for-seniors/washington/

SouthSoundTree said:

Raj, have you seen the Belay Spool thread. A good piece of equipment for a solo operator, and any crew.

Click to expand...

https://www.masterblasterhome.com/showthread.php?13704-BMS-Belay-Spool&highlight=belay+spool

I've got an older gent that does my stumps during the summer with my machine. It's a 70/20/10 deal. He gets the bulk since it's his truck and time, the machine gets the midline and I get what's left, which is essentially nothing. It keeps him happy and busy, my machine in repair, me in beer and the customers happy. Older dudes can ramble if they want and this guy is a great salesman.

The older guy i often work with goes to bed at 7PM. He gets to the job and it's like Usain Bolt coming out of the starting blocks. Sort of a blur if you are still groggy yourself.

Don't hire a dummy Sean. You are over simplifying what you want out of a dummy. You'll need more out of that person out of anyone on the job then just dragging and raking. Plus, guys that are content to do those tasks and nothing else, are usually capable of screwing up even those tasks. Plus, the idea of just meet you at the job and keep them away from home and shop, well, that sets the tone for how you feel about them. Sounds great, until they feel that way about you. If they arrive each day thinking they are a disposable chimp, they'll view you as a disposable prick, and that will bite you in the ass one morning when you are waiting for him to show on a big important job....

Seek good men, train them, and start over when they move on. Its the nature of the work force. Someone trained you, and you moved on. We all did.

I mean this respectfully of course. I sense you are coming up with a new logic, based on frustration, and Im just trying to be a voice of reason.

Indeed

Chris said it eloquently, and in the very least, if you can't hire someone with the capacity to learn, and that wants to, hell's bells! It doesn't have to be a learn for the occupation for life learning thing, but to develop practicality and know safe procedures for themselves and for others, within the context of what they are doing. Tree work isn't just about tree work, it's about life in general as well. Once upon a time I would become pissed myself if some person complained about a barricade blocking a road, or like an idiot drove by one. Now I apologize for the inconvenience and try hard to be pleasant enough, even though in the inside I might be feeling quite differently. Tree work taught me that self control.

Tucker943 said:

Don't hire a dummy Sean. You are over simplifying what you want out of a dummy. You'll need more out of that person out of anyone on the job then just dragging and raking. Plus, guys that are content to do those tasks and nothing else, are usually capable of screwing up even those tasks. Plus, the idea of just meet you at the job and keep them away from home and shop, well, that sets the tone for how you feel about them. Sounds great, until they feel that way about you. If they arrive each day thinking they are a disposable chimp, they'll view you as a disposable prick, and that will bite you in the ass one morning when you are waiting for him to show on a big important job....


Seek good men, train them, and start over when they move on. Its the nature of the work force. Someone trained you, and you moved on. We all did.

I mean this respectfully of course. I sense you are coming up with a new logic, based on frustration, and Im just trying to be a voice of reason.

Click to expand...

thanks man, I needed to hear that 'cause I'm totally feeling like that guy movin' on. I feel pretty guilty about it and its just good to hear this, thanks.

Not always black or white. Sometimes feeling guilty is called for. Payback.

i bought a grapple truck i roll out w/ 2 guys now . ( down sized this year) I rarely bring chipper anymore except for large jobs usually can fit the whole day in that truck.

Anyone that can learn wont feed a chipper for long IMO

Best to have a mix of low-high skilled.

I think we should nominate Chris to " Poster of the month".

Lots of well thought out eloquently written posts from him lately.

This one really hits it on the head IMO.

That is how I've always looked at my apprentices.
Treat them well, so they feel valued. Teach them all you can, and when/if they move on, at least they will remember you fondly.

For me it is not just a question of having people who are able to do the work, I want them to be a type of folks, that can make the work day enjoyable.
That is why we are so super critical when hiring new apprentices, they really have to squeeze through the eye of a needle to get a job with us, but then we usually have a good working relationship with them afterwards. I have quite a few former apprentices running their own shows, that I can call on, when we need help, just like they call me.

I'm doing this kind of work because I like it. Having good employees makes it enjoyable, having to prod a dumb brush monkey along with a pointed stick all day and wondering if he'll show up tomorrow,isn't worth it.

Amen Stig!