Splicing X Rings

bonner1040

Nick from Ohio
Joined
Nov 25, 2011
Messages
5,853
Location
Indianapolis / Cleveland
Yo, WiscoNick!

So, I have two of the x rigging rings coming and want to make a rigging saver like a friction saver.

My plan is to use 1/2" tenex for its ease of splicing. For abrasion resistance I plan to take a cordura sheath and cut it lengthwise; then wrap it tight on the tenex and lock stitch it the entire length of the sling. The idea is to prevent it from bunching if installed or retrieved remotely.

What is the best way to splice it? Should I do a locked brummel? Can i do a locking brummel onto two thimbles? What about a straight bury splice? that seems easiest yes?

I am thinking I want to get to as close to 36" as possible, but the splicing instructions for 1/2" tenenx list a 2 fid bury (22" right?) so thats a minimum of 44"?

I have to order the tenex so... whichever way you recommend to use can you give me a length that i should buy?

Nick


PS

How did they make this:

https://www.treestuff.com/store/cata...=455&item=2162
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #4
Man I would at the very least go with 3/4" tenex......

Really? Looking at the Minimum Breaking Strength not Average Breaking Strength 1/2" is 11,800lbs. Figure if I retain 80% of that @ the splice it is 9440 lbs MBS. The SWL of my porta wrap is 2000lbs, doubling that at a block/ring saver to 4000lbs. The dead lift on the GRCS is 3000lbs doubled to 6000lbs at the rigging point.

I figure anything big is getting rigged with a block and as far as I know the smaller the diameter the shorter the minimum length.

What makes you saw 3/4?


Samson Tenex Tec
Size - MBS - ABS
3/8 - 5,500 - 6,100
1/2 - 11,800 - 13,000
5/8 - 16,900 - 18,800
3/4 - 22,300 - 24,800
7/8 - 30,800 - 34,200
 
I think it depends on application. Personally, I think 1/2" will be plenty strong. Your always going to be using it in a basket configuration, which is the strongest and retains 100% of the strength of the rope.

As for splicing, to my knowledge there is no easy way to do a double locked Brummell with the rings on both ends, tho Cali Nick will prolly prove me wrong on that. As far as strength, a straight bury is the strongest splice you can do. I'd recommend doing a straight bury with full cross over. This is where you take the tails and cross them over in the middle and taper everything. It forms a kind of Chinese finger trap is the best way I've heard it described. Off the top of my head, it's possible to do a 3ft set up, tho I'd prolly go with a 40" or 44" set up myself.
 
What are you trying to save 28cents on cordage??? go with the 3/4 and never have to worry about it, remember cycles to failure is dependant on % of rope strength so get the stronger rope and dont sweat it.. IMO
 
My plan is to use 1/2" tenex for its ease of splicing. For abrasion resistance I plan to take a cordura sheath and cut it lengthwise; then wrap it tight on the tenex and lock stitch it the entire length of the sling. The idea is to prevent it from bunching if installed or retrieved remotely.

For the sake of the discussion, I don't think we can really judge what size line you should be using. I would be perfectly content with 1/2" line, but some guys might need bigger line to handle more weight. Either way.

I've done the stitching down of the chafe sleeve. It will work we'll. I did a whipping at each end, much like the way you would whip the cover on the 8mm beeline splice. On the first one I also did big stitches across the whole chafe sleeve, but on subsequent slings opted against that step and JUST did the whippings on each end. Fastest way might be to do a double constrictor hitch at each end of the sleeve.

What is the best way to splice it? Should I do a locked brummel? Can i do a locking brummel onto two thimbles? What about a straight bury splice? that seems easiest yes? I am thinking I want to get to as close to 36" as possible

Personally, I would strive to maintain locked brummels on both. I would do some practicing of a 4 strand braid and do the reweave Brummell on the second eye.

A straight bury could TOTALLY be achieved. The 1/2" fid isn't 22inches. It's 22x the rope diameter....about 11"

With the other tail, it would be tight, but very do-able



I good way to envision it: imagine you make a locking Brummell splice with a realllly big eye. Now take that eye and cut it right at the apex of the eye. You have to long tails. Splice an eye on each of those tails. Bam- done.

I didn't spend more than 3 seconds looking at the pic to determine the EXACT procedure taken (as far as which eye it would make sense to make first and all that) but I think you get the idea.

Bring on those follow up questions!

love
nick
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #11
Minimum length is my big concern. Whats the minimum I can go with 3/4"? 32" bury for each splice. If you taper the the second fid of both and o an overlap its still 48" so 50" something? I guess 40-44 like Adrian suggested would be fine.

Maybe 5/8's? The other thing with 3/4's, it looks like the running line might rub on the sling, you have one with 3/4's right does that happen?

Screen shot 2013-02-22 at 9.49.55 PM.png

can anyone give the minimum lengths for 1/2" 5/8" and 3/4"?

I do agree that going bigger would give more security.
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #12
It's Nick, that boy can squeeze a dollar out of a dime!

I am hardly cheap.

... I would do some practicing of a 4 strand braid and do the reweave Brummell on the second eye. ...

I dont know about a reweave brummell

A straight bury could TOTALLY be achieved. The 1/2" fid isn't 22inches. It's 22x the rope diameter....about 11"

With the other tail, it would be tight, but very do-able

Right but isnt the bury on a straight bury splice 2 fids? or is standard 22x the diameter. If so thats easy enough.

So the bury for:

1/2" = 22
5/8" = 27.5
3/4" = 33
 
One fid = 22x rope diameter.

Bury length on straight bury is 2 fids.

Therefore, for half inch rope you need to bury 22" or 2 x 22 x (1/2)

If you locking Brummell each side, you can make super short tails. I could see making a 1/2 eye-eye about....I dunno....16" long?

love
nick
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #14
1/2" = 22 x2 =44
5/8" = 27.5 x2 =55
3/4" = 33 x2 ==66

Doing the overlap Adrian described how much can I take off those?

How do you put a locking brummel on both sides? Maybe I should should locking brummel one side and straight bury the other using 3/4. How short can the Brummel bury be for 3/4's
 
What I am about to describe sounds ridiculous, but practice it twice and on the third one you'll be an expert.

1- do splice -#1, locking Brummell with the x ring. No big whoop.

2- start splice two as normal. Get the x-ring in position and Tuck the tail into the standing end of the rope

3- now you would normally tuck the standing end into the tail, but of course you can't do that. There is an x-ring on the end of the standing end. Now begins the reweave Brummell

3a- with whipping twine, tie constrictor hitch around running end just beyond the first tuck.
3b- start unravelling the running end of the rope. No joke. Take it apart. All the way up to the constrictor hitch you put on.
3c- now you for 4 even bundles. It's a 12 strand rope. So you'll make 4 bundles of 3 strands each. Tape the end of each bundle together to keep it all organized.
3d- take 2 bundles and go left of the standing end. The other two go right. They all meet on the other side. Instead of the standing end going through the RE, the RE goes AROUND the SE.
3e- using a 4 strand weave, weave the four bundles together to reweave the rope. In doing so, you will create the locked Brummell.
4- finish the splice as normal.

Chew on that.


love
nick
 
love nick wrote:
"Chew on that. "

Mmm, tasty... and difficult to keep it looking clean... well, at least first time... I definitely need more practice.
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #17
I wonder if anyone else realized how I got Nick to give up his secret! I got him excited about splicing and he just let it go!

I will have to try it for sure.... So with 3/4" tenex, how long does the bury have to be after both tucks?
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #18
Wait...

I dont have any tenex tec in my hand, its in my truck but:

825.jpg


Looking at this is it 12 strand or 12 pairs of 2? Maybe I will have to wait to get some before it makes sense. I am also not understanding how the bundles of 3, taped at the end will reweave, but I will try it!
 
Really? Looking at the Minimum Breaking Strength not Average Breaking Strength 1/2" is 11,800lbs. Figure if I retain 80% of that @ the splice it is 9440 lbs MBS. The SWL of my porta wrap is 2000lbs, doubling that at a block/ring saver to 4000lbs. The dead lift on the GRCS is 3000lbs doubled to 6000lbs at the rigging point.

I figure anything big is getting rigged with a block and as far as I know the smaller the diameter the shorter the minimum length.

What makes you saw 3/4?


Samson Tenex Tec
Size - MBS - ABS
3/8 - 5,500 - 6,100
1/2 - 11,800 - 13,000
5/8 - 16,900 - 18,800
3/4 - 22,300 - 24,800
7/8 - 30,800 - 34,200
In your math, you forgot something very important : the safety factor.
It should be 7 for textile gear (takes in count wear, aging, weathering, multiple stress...). The 1/2" Tenex is too close to the failure at your max load.
With the dead lift of the GRCS, the block takes 6000 lbs, so each leg of an usual sling in a basket mode have to be rated at 3000 lbs x 7 = 21000lbs. That's a 3/4" Tenex's job.
But if you tie the block with a stillson (one working leg), the sling should be rated at 6000 x 7 = 42000lbs !
7/8" isn't enough now.
Go farer and take your project: say the sling with the X rings is set remotely from ground to hold the block with a bull rope tied at the stump. The block holds 6000lbs, but the crotch takes 12000lbs. The bull rope must have a breaking strength of 6000 x 7 = 42000lbs. Hopefully, the sling is in a basket mode and shares the load between its both legs, but that's still 6000, so 42000lbs breaking strength for the sling too.
You are good to take a 1" Tenex to stay in the book.

I'm not sure if there is a X ring wide enough.
If you just want to put a redirect on the rigging line, the load would be either far from that (for a fair-lead above the GRCS for example), or very close to the previous values ( for a drastic redirect or more over if the main rigging point fails).

So, go big for the slings.
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #22
I think I got it! What was sticking me is that your are reweaving it differently than the normal 12 strand weave.

It is a 4 strand weave that you are re-weaving the tail into, then burying right?

Is there an issue with burying a different weave than normal? I guess not huh?

Now all I need to know is how long I have to bury the tails for 3/4" tenex and how to do the taper on the 4 strand re-weave. (keeping in mind that each strand in the 4 strand weave will actually be 3 pairs of double carrier tenex tec)
 
Back
Top