No_Bivy
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E-Collars
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MasterBlaster
Administrator Emeritus
Never heard of them.
PCTREE
Treehouser
I used a similar system years ago. However IMO the range advertised is no where near accurate, whilst MTB riding if they got about 500 yards away in the woods it didnt work. You get a new dog??
You can't train a dog with them.
They only work well for aversion therapy.
You can use them to make a dog believe that sheep, deer or other " non-chasers" are electric or that the land surrounding your property is electric unless the dog is in your company.
Even so, you have to be extremely careful to think like a dog, and make sure you don't make the dog associate the electric shock with something other than what you intend.
A good example is one dog I had, old Sam, who happened to veer into the electric fence as I swung a fencepost up on my shoulder.
For the rest of his life, hed cringe and run off if someone swung an implement like a rake up on their shoulder, expecting to be shocked.
The logic of dogs is anything but linear.
There is a good reason those collars are illegal to use in most European countries. ( Outside the facts that we are a bunch of "big brother is watching you" commies, who outlaw anything that is the least bit fun).
What exactly were you hoping to accomplish by using the collar, that couldn't be done just as well with a bit of patience?
They only work well for aversion therapy.
You can use them to make a dog believe that sheep, deer or other " non-chasers" are electric or that the land surrounding your property is electric unless the dog is in your company.
Even so, you have to be extremely careful to think like a dog, and make sure you don't make the dog associate the electric shock with something other than what you intend.
A good example is one dog I had, old Sam, who happened to veer into the electric fence as I swung a fencepost up on my shoulder.
For the rest of his life, hed cringe and run off if someone swung an implement like a rake up on their shoulder, expecting to be shocked.
The logic of dogs is anything but linear.
There is a good reason those collars are illegal to use in most European countries. ( Outside the facts that we are a bunch of "big brother is watching you" commies, who outlaw anything that is the least bit fun).
What exactly were you hoping to accomplish by using the collar, that couldn't be done just as well with a bit of patience?
PCTREE
Treehouser
Stig we dont have time for patience
No_Bivy
Treehouser
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to avoid interaction with an unexpected Bear/turkey or whatever motivates here to bolt. I have made great strides with the prong type collar for leashed walks
she relieably will sit and stay, heel
but if she is off leash......good bye.
I just spent 15 min using the ecollar....nicked her a few times and back she came. Now she will stay right with me with no leash. I dont expect it to be magic bullet by no means
I have a friend who uses one ...... on a ride we encoutered bear and off dog went...not good. One nick stopped her dead in her tracks.
I know rewards work, no doubt. But I think sometimes pain is a bit more powerful
why do you always bring up commie thing?lots of things suck in europe
I surfed around the web and found some amazing trained bristish dogs..no ecollars, but my guess is they spent a very long time to get there. I dont have a way to stop a wildlife interaction if it was to happen
just loooking for tips on there use.....not a lecture why they are bad
she relieably will sit and stay, heel
but if she is off leash......good bye.
I just spent 15 min using the ecollar....nicked her a few times and back she came. Now she will stay right with me with no leash. I dont expect it to be magic bullet by no means
I have a friend who uses one ...... on a ride we encoutered bear and off dog went...not good. One nick stopped her dead in her tracks.
I know rewards work, no doubt. But I think sometimes pain is a bit more powerful
why do you always bring up commie thing?lots of things suck in europe
I surfed around the web and found some amazing trained bristish dogs..no ecollars, but my guess is they spent a very long time to get there. I dont have a way to stop a wildlife interaction if it was to happen
just loooking for tips on there use.....not a lecture why they are bad
tophopper
The resident asshole
Like Stig says.....aversion training only. It sounds like you have the right idea.
Sorry, I thought I covered their use, or at least their use as I see it.
Great for teaching that some things shouldn't be chased and defining borders of territory.
But if you intend to use the dog for hunting, teaching it that some animals are electrically charged, will be counterproductive.
At all times think: "How will the dog reason it got zapped", not how a human would reason it out.
One example: I knew a hunter whose dog wouldn't let go of the pheasants it retrieved. So to teach it to let go of the dead bird, he zapped it.
Dog logic told it that pheasants are electric, so it never picked up another one.
Seems like most of my tips are negative, as in " Don't do this". So let me say that I have used one with great succes to teach my present Sam ( last of a line of Sams!) that fallow deer are not to be chased. I could teach him not to chase hares, roe deer and cats, but something about those flocks of stupid grain fed fallow deer just drew him in. I only had to zap him hard twice and he completely ignored them ever after.
Great for teaching that some things shouldn't be chased and defining borders of territory.
But if you intend to use the dog for hunting, teaching it that some animals are electrically charged, will be counterproductive.
At all times think: "How will the dog reason it got zapped", not how a human would reason it out.
One example: I knew a hunter whose dog wouldn't let go of the pheasants it retrieved. So to teach it to let go of the dead bird, he zapped it.
Dog logic told it that pheasants are electric, so it never picked up another one.
Seems like most of my tips are negative, as in " Don't do this". So let me say that I have used one with great succes to teach my present Sam ( last of a line of Sams!) that fallow deer are not to be chased. I could teach him not to chase hares, roe deer and cats, but something about those flocks of stupid grain fed fallow deer just drew him in. I only had to zap him hard twice and he completely ignored them ever after.
No_Bivy
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cool
http://www.dogtrastore.com/280ncp.html
couple of thoughts,
The collar I bought has adjustable levels from 1 to 127, I noticed a tingle myself at about 40( very tame IMO)
also has a vibratiting page.
after 4 15min sessions, I only have to nick the collar once or twice...maybe a couple of pages too....she is right there on every command
of course I am rewarding with food for all the other times she obeys...
I see your point stig.......I will only use for aversion..which seems to becoming less and less already.
....next is the Turkey test...we will see
http://www.dogtrastore.com/280ncp.html
couple of thoughts,
The collar I bought has adjustable levels from 1 to 127, I noticed a tingle myself at about 40( very tame IMO)
also has a vibratiting page.
after 4 15min sessions, I only have to nick the collar once or twice...maybe a couple of pages too....she is right there on every command
of course I am rewarding with food for all the other times she obeys...
I see your point stig.......I will only use for aversion..which seems to becoming less and less already.
....next is the Turkey test...we will see
Tucker943
Bamboo Plantation Owner
I use a tri tronics pro 500 on my dogs. Good tool. In the hands on 99% of people they must only be used fir reinforcement and aversion training. In the hands of accomplished professional trainers who truly know what they are doing, they can in certain circumstances be used to train. Such as force fetching. My waterfowling dog was force fetched with the collar as the trainer. I didn't do that though. A full time pro did. My dogs LOVE their e collars. They know it means we are headed hunting or training and go nuts with joy when they see me get the collar out.
tophopper
The resident asshole
My dogs go nuts when the safe gets opened.
Tucker943
Bamboo Plantation Owner
E collars have drawn mixed attention over the years. I absolutely and firmly believe they have aided in preventing a lot of harm to dogs, people, and wildlife. The collar has saved my german shorthair from a face full of porky quills many times. I do cringe when I hear people throwing an e collar on their puppy or adult dog with no understanding of how they must be used. There's way too many scared and confused dogs out there that can blame their ignorant owner for the unintentional abuse they've taken.
No_Bivy
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My kids do not have permission to use it for that very reason. They always yell shock her shock her. I explain to them she is not a remote control dog. She listens better then my six year old........he could use a collar too.
What I have discovered is the page(vibrate)feature is a very gentle correction. I've been doing several short sessions a day so far. Only had to nick her one time when she tried to head to my neighbors dogs...(caged boxers.....so called rescue program over there)
When she gets really amped up, I put her back on lead for a short time till she mellows out. Distraction training is the biggest challenge so far...
