Rethinking positioning lanyards

[top hopper]

cross posted at the buzz....

page 4 of the attached pdf is a great little article written by a good friend, who likes to think outside the box. I thought Id post it here for those of you who dont care to visit TB

http://vptree.com/images/Winter_08_Arboresence.pdf

[Paul B]

cool!

[Skwerl]

Yup, creativity is good! Since I've always used a short lanyard (less than 8'), I've come up with all sorts of lengthening methods over the years. The two main methods I use when necessary are the SRT and the loop runner as mentioned in the article.
8)

[MasterBlaster]

Thanks John, great article!

[xtremetrees]

Great shots in the pdf, thanks!

[Frans]

please warn us (me) when you post a link which is a pdf.

I think it is bad manners to do that as it temp. locks up my computer.

For example right now when I hit your link, I am also downloading another file so it messed things up. And yes, I have high speed internet.

[Paul B]

Frans, I dont understand, it didnt seem to cause an issue here. its a 2 meg file though, it might tie up the interweb highway. Is it a software issue?

[Skwerl]

He did, Frans. Not only did he say it was a PDF but the link ends in ".pdf" which tells you that it's a PDF. What else would you suggest he do?
:|:

It doesn't lock up my computer, but it does take several seconds to download before it will open. Much longer than a picture of the same file size.

[No_Bivy]

PDF!!!!!!nooo prob.....

[MasterBlaster]

No problems here.

[top hopper]

Sorry Frans,

but as Skwerl mentioned, I did mention it was a pdf in my post.





cross posted at the buzz....

page 4 of the attached pdf is a great little article written by a good friend, who likes to think outside the box. I thought Id post it here for those of you who dont care to visit TB

http://vptree.com/images/Winter_08_Arboresence.pdf

[OTGBOSTON]

I was putting together a new lanyard today! Went from a 10' to a 20'. Toyed with the idea of adding a loop. Looks like I may just have to do it......I'll post some pics

[OTGBOSTON]

first is the old one. I've had it for about 7 years, figured it was time for a new one. Still need to add the loop and a snap(believe it or not all 3 of the local arb stores were sold out) anyway, I got the new 20footer with a splice for $20 too good to pass up.

[Skwerl]

HA! Greg, your old lanyard setup looks virtually identical to mine except for a different slack tender on the hitch. I ended up dropping the tender altogether and just run the rope through the carabiner. By pulling out on the tail, the carabiner acts as the hitch tender. Just my way of eliminating extra bulk wherever possible.
:)

[OTGBOSTON]

8) twisted clevis in the first pic, ring from my D-fly in the second. I hear what you're saying, this way works better for me especially ifn the hitch gets really tight. I don't understand why anyone uses mechanical devices for a lanyard, more crapola IMO.

Anyone got a pic/description of the loop used in the article. I tried a few different ways today but think I need some different cord.

[sotc]

i love my micro grab, doesnt wear out, works in pitchy trees, doesnt bind

[MasterBlaster]

I love my Gibbs.

[OTGBOSTON]

I love rope.:D

[Frans]

I tried that lanyard set up a while back and it instantly got pitched up. Perhaps it works best in hardwood trees with little sap. I use the ART adjuster on my small flip lines a gibbs on the bigger flip lines.


As for that PDF issue I have/had,
Some PDF forms open in a new window, while this one downloaded to my desktop. That seemed to be the problem.

Why do certain PDF files only open a new window, while others download to the desktop?

[NickfromWI]

OTG- is that orange rope Yale 12 strand Buzzzline?

Frans- I don't know what the deal is, but I have the same problem. Clicking on the pdf link basically freezes up my computer for the next 20 seconds to a minute (depending on the size of the pdf). I am using Firefox. I wonder if it works different in Internet Explorer.

love
nick

[Greenhorn]

Guys around here just tie a prussic with small cordage around the main lanyard line and clip in to that should srt stuff be necessary. Pretty simple.

[OTGBOSTON]

OTG- is that orange rope Yale 12 strand Buzzzline?


love
nick


Pretty stuff huh? It's tachyon (PDF WARNING!!!)http://www.neropes.com/datasheets/tachyon.pdf

Nick (or anyone), can you recommend a narrow diameter line for the prussic attachment for the lanyard? The bailout was just too bulky......

[bushman]

I like my blaze with the grillon ,runs good,i like runing the eye to eye cord and micro.on my other lanyard [vt,or distel] works pretty good.

[Ax-Man]

Does anyone see the practicallity for using one of those small prussiks on your lanyard???? Am I missing something here??? Comments over at the Buzz made was that it looks so cool and different on your lanyard. So what. If it isn't pratical what use is it???

The ability to use your lanyard as a mini SRT system is good. I have my lanyard set-up for just such a use when needed only instead of the biner- prussik combo. I just use a loop runner in either a choked fashion or in a basket configuration and attach a biner to it and then my lanyard snap or just the snap alone will usually suffice.

I did try this prussik- biner combo out. A little, only not in a tree. I had a prussik tied onto my lanyard and simulated working with it and quickly dicarded it. If the prussik remained on the lanyard it would get in my way and be a source of irritation. Tying it on when needed would also be a pain and somewhat of a time waster. Using the loop runner is quicker and faster to me and will give you a little more length.

I suppose I could trade the loop runner for the prussik on my saddle but I get more use from the loop runner than I ever would from the prussik and I don't care to add anymore gear to my saddle.

I made a similar comment over at the Buzz and like all comments I make on climbing it was not all that well recieved because I am going against the grain of someone's new style way of climbing. I will probaly get the same cold shoulder reaction here but I don't care. I just don't see what is so great about this.

Don't get me wrong, there is nothing wrong with this set-up I personally just don't see it as being all that useful like other things I have seen come along in the climbing scene the last few years.

Let the stoning begin

[OTGBOSTON]

good call Ax-man! I like your method and I will use it! thanks:)

[Frans]

Does anyone see the practicallity for using one of those small prussiks on your lanyard???? Am I missing something here???

If you are missing something, then I also am missing the same thing. I dont care for this method but for different reasons. Pitch is a big deal with my business, and prussik cords on flip lines only work for a bit, and then stick.
I use stuff which will work in any kind of tree, in any kind of weather.
It amazes me when I see pix of guys daily gear and it looks so clean. Maybe I should move to a different area?



I will probaly get the same cold shoulder reaction here but I don't care. I just don't see what is so great about this.


Why would you here? Its NOT the buzz which has a whole population of folks who like to nitpick.



Let the stoning begin


Wheres my rock?!!!:D:)

[OTGBOSTON]

It amazes me when I see pix of guys daily gear and it looks so clean. Maybe I should move to a different area?


Pitch has never been a huge problem for me here on the east coast. Usually try to do those removals in the winter which helps alot.....

[top hopper]

The additional prussik is like anything else. If you are comfortable with it, you will use it. I tend to agree that it doesnt really fit my climbing style either. But I have watched the author use it day in and day out and to him it is not a nuisance, but rather an additional tool in the tool bag. Nothing wrong with having another trick up your sleave is there? Speedwise- Im sure its much faster to choke onto a limb srt with that set up vs. getting out a loop runner and choking that to the limb then connecting into that.
When the additional prussik is not in use, it is simply "parked" near the bury of the splice on the lanyard with the loose end captured inside the biner. Completely out of the way as your adjuster whether it be hitch cord or mechanical does not advance up and over the bury of the splice anyway.

Regarding pitch, its not a problem at all here unless you get into a bunch of evergreens which is not all that common. Id guess 95% percent of the work I do is on deciduous trees where pitch build up is not a problem. Ive tried many types of adjuster for my lanyard; gibbs, microcender, art positioner, trango and even a grillion. For me, hitch cord is the only way to fly, but thats not to say any other way is wrong, just my preference.

[top hopper]

and Ax-man!!


if I ever see you in person........








:D:lol::P



kidding of course! :)

I dont think the intent of this method is to come across as THE best method.
Like everything else in our business- what works for me or the next guy, may not for you, and honestly there is nothing wrong with that. But everyone of us likes to have as many options available to make our jobs just a little easier. And Im sure even YOU will agree with that!!

No stone throwing here my friend.

[Hollywood]

Thank you all for the comments! The article was written as a quick introduction to the SRT lanyard. It certainly does not cover the pros and cons of each configuration. I use this technique so often (multiple times in one tree) that I find the small lanyard prusik much faster to deploy and re-stow than choking with a looprunner. How much faster? Probably not much, but it's how I do most of my SRT'ing. The small lanyard prusik is not always the appropriate tool, hence the other highlighted methods of attachment.

[Ax-Man]

Top,

Yes, I will agree 100% that a climber needs to try as many options and different methods as he or she can find to improve their climbing skills and to make an ardious job and sometimes aggrivatting job as pleasant as possible. Then it is up to the individual to either use the new method or discard it like you said.

With that said let's get back to the small prussik.

Stowing the prussik in the manner that has been described then I will agree that it is faster and could even be easier that the loop runner method.

Again, I differ from the author as I don't use a biner for attachment of the lanyard end. I have gone the biner route on the end of a lanyard and went back to a snap. To me it is much easier using a snap verses the biner. The biner felt awkward in both motions of attaching and removing it from the side d ring. Without unpacking my gear I don't think the loop end of the prussik stowed inside of a sanp would work as well as it would with a biner.

In all fairness to the author I think the use of the small prussik is a brillant idea. It side steps and avoids many issues of the evils of side loading a biner or a snap if you were to choke it around a limb. If I have come on a little strong on this subject that wasn't my intention at all.

Frans, you do need to move. The trees are much cleaner east of the Misssisloppy River:P . I have noticed this about using a mechanical adjuster as the preferred adjuster for the left coast crowd, others have made that same comment about pitch locking up a cord. Also I noticed in the GRCS vid the climber was using a Gibbs. Was that shot out in California??? I used my Gibbs with 3 strand last fall for a pine removal last fall to spare my good lanyard from the dreaded pitch. No thanks. I"ll stick with my FP.

[top hopper]

Top,



Again, I differ from the author as I don't use a biner for attachment of the lanyard end. I have gone the biner route on the end of a lanyard and went back to a snap. To me it is much easier using a snap verses the biner. The biner felt awkward in both motions of attaching and removing it from the side d ring. Without unpacking my gear I don't think the loop end of the prussik stowed inside of a sanp would work as well as it would with a biner.

In all fairness to the author I think the use of the small prussik is a brillant idea. It side steps and avoids many issues of the evils of side loading a biner or a snap if you were to choke it around a limb. If I have come on a little strong on this subject that wasn't my intention at all.




I too prefer a snap for my lanyard, and agree that the small prussik wouldnt stow as well vs using a biner.
I also agree the small prussik does eliminate the potential issue of biner side loading, and thats why I think some climbers are using this method.

I dont think you came off overly strong, you were just sharing your opinion and thats what these forums are for right?

[Ax-Man]

Right :thumbup: That is what these forums are all about to help one other and learn from each other.

I'd split your quote up Top but I still haven't quite gotten the hang of how to do it the same way as you guys do it. Let's not go there I'll figure it out, some day.

[top hopper]

Ha- I dont split qoutes either.

Too technical for me!

[MasterBlaster]

You just gotta THINK about how to do it.

[top hopper]

THINKING makes my head hurt. I prefer to just muddle along and pretend to know what I'm doing. Much easier.

[MasterBlaster]

Hint... copy/paste

[top hopper]

There you go with those technical terms again.....




:lol:

[Ax-Man]

Hint... copy/paste

Hmmm, didn't know that. I can delete out what I need to and chop a quote up but never thought to copy and paste in what I needed too.

[MasterBlaster]

Sometimes I use another forum's editor to make it easier. ;)

[Oxman]

Stealin code is neigh onto horse thievin round these parts.

[MasterBlaster]

Why's that? I steal smilies from several forums.

[OTGBOSTON]

where are the pics of these alleged posiitioning lanyards:/:

[brendonv]

I use a 3/8" line rope snap on the end, with a VT tied directly to the D, with a snap as the prusik minder.

[Frans]

Stealin code is neigh onto horse thievin round these parts.

Boy I have not heard from Mike Oxman for some time. How are you Mike?

[xtremetrees]

Is that the original oxman from the first ISA forum that knew Pete Donzelli with a master degre in engineering?

Nice post hollywood! Welcome to the treehouse!:O