Tree Machine's Shotline Winder

[Koa Man]

Ok, as I promised in Tree Machine email thread, I have pictures of his winder upper for the throwball. He gave it to me at the last Columbus TCI Expo, while he was still recovering from that horrific stump grinder accident. I have been using a throwball quite a bit more, previously I hated to stuff the line back in the bag. This one makes rewinding the line very easy. It is currently loaded with 180 ft. of Zing It.

[Skwerl]

Pretty slick. :thumbup:

[No_Bivy]

So will it deploy off the spool without having to unwind it?

[Stumper]

Those whizly gidgets are sold as kite winders aren't they?

[MasterBlaster]

Where did he get it?

[Ax-Man]

That is pretty slick, I like much better than the fishing reel thing everyone suggests I use to rewind a throwline. I also hate stuffing throwline. I use a big food container with a lid. It was great when I got it, but plastic breaks with age. Storage is a problem in the truck along with all the other junk I think I have to carry around with me to do a job.

This idea looks good to me as I am rethinking of ways to store throwline and at the same time save space. TM 's thing looks like it has a big enough diameter as to not cause backlashes in the line and would spool off the reel smoothly when throwing and be able to wind the line up quick when done with it.

One of the guys in our Ill. Arborist Chapter who is a contender in the state climbing competion has something that funtions similar but isn't the same if you know what I mean. If you have ever been to a Mexican restarant and ordered tacos that come in a container with a lid to keep them hot is what he uses. Almost the same diameter as TM 's winder but instead of winding the line he spools the line around the inside of the container, then he just put the lid on and stowed it in his duffle bag he uses for climbing. Works for him as I watched put his gear away after the Masters Challenge, his method looked to be quick and easy. I don't know what line he was using and I am sure the line had a memory to it as it just looked a little too easy.

I like TM's winder, can you buy this somewhere? I am not into kiting. I could make something that is similar but I have other things to do. Just easier to go out and buy something to save time and some fooling around.

[Koa Man]

It deploys perfectly off the spool. I have never ever had it get hung up. I think he told me he made it. He had 2 and gave 1 to me. Where he got the parts to make it, you would need to ask him. I do have his cell number, but I would have to check with him first before I give it to anyone.

Stuffing line back into a bag was the one reason I did not like to use throw balls unless I absolutely had to. I would toss my rope over a lower crotch and work my way up. I use throw balls way more now. He gave it to me a couple of years ago, but it has just been 3 months since I got it out of storage and started using it.

[JonnyHart]

He should patent and market it. I'd buy one.

[xtremetrees]

Hands down tree machine is the most innovative and advanced climber Ive ever seen on the internet!

[Stumper]

Hands down tree machine is the most innovative and advanced climber Ive ever seen on the internet!
Not only is Jim innovative but he works miracles on the side-Notice that Robert posted an intelligible sentence!

[No_Bivy]

Hands down tree machine is the most innovative and advanced climber Ive ever seen on the internet!

now...I'm skeered:/: :O

[pantheraba]

You boys play nice...glad to see you back XT...hope all has been well for you.

[No_Bivy]

OK.........well it does deploy good? any vids of it in action?

[Koa Man]

Like I mentioned earlier, it deploys perfectly with no hangups. I don't have a regular video camera, but maybe I could video it with my phone and send it to you that way.

[Mangoes]

Faltemier

;)

[sotc]

fold n hold;)

[Skwerl]

I just got an email from Tree Machine.


Hey,

I dropped into the treehouse, saw that Koa posted about my
linewinder. I couldn't password in.

Reply for me. Tell em you've summoned me in and that I'll drop in
and answer questions, mebbe tomorrow.

Thanks TM

Hurry your ass up, Jim! :P

[No_Bivy]

Faltemier

;)
Me too...but a few back up spools would be nice if they work......

[MasterBlaster]

I just got an email from Tree Machine.

Hey,

I dropped into the treehouse, saw that Koa posted about my
linewinder. I couldn't password in.

Reply for me. Tell em you've summoned me in and that I'll drop in
and answer questions, mebbe tomorrow.

Thanks TM



Hurry your ass up, Jim! :P



Jim is no longer a member, he needs to re-register.

[gf beranek]

That's pretty cool. First time I've seen one. You could get rid of the clamp to hold the bag and use a little snap in its place. Neat

[Hobby Climber]

This should get his attention...;)


Hey Jim... look!

Only available in Canada...unless your going to the 2008 TCIA EXPO in WI .:D



Bob (aka-Hobby Climber)

[lumberjack]

Come on Wesely, you know you liked my Faltemier!

[Koa Man]

What's a Faltemier? Not familiar with that term.

BTW Carl, did you check out the cell phone ringtones thread? I posted a ringtone that would be perfect for you.

[lumberjack]

Ha lemme find that thread.

The Faltemier is that box of throwline I had that folded down to a neat triangle/folded flag shaped object.

Open box, throw line, repack line as you are pulling the rope up, get to work. Works just as well in the forrest or other twiggy environment, the throwline rarely touches the ground to get fouled up.

[brendonv]

The Faltemier.

I just ordered one, hope it's as good as they say for the $$.

[lumberjack]

You saw mine eh? Or did I not bring it?

[brendonv]

Na, didn't bring it. Showed me at the show though. And I got tired one day sticking my hand into that tiny ass bag. It'll be here wends.

[No_Bivy]

If you fold the f-cube...you can still have a fouled throw..

[lumberjack]

It's fairly rare, at least compared to stuffing it in a line mug.

Keep the twigs, leaves, and anything but the throwline and bags out of the cube and you should have dandy luck.

Two days ago, after several throws that day setting lines in trees to pull the tops out, I had a couple throws that used all 180' of line. It all played out without issue.

[Hobby Climber]

What do you guys think of a smaller "modified" version of this???

HC

.

[Hobby Climber]

I would like to see TM's line-real system in action though, I like the concept!

[No_Bivy]

Carl...are you throwing Rhino line or zing-it?

[Paul B]

seems like the WIDE opening and the collapsable bag seem to be impotent for the tree dudes.

[Skwerl]

As mentioned before, I've had great luck using a 3.5 gallon bucket. It's the same as a standard 5 gallon bucket but shorter. My Big Shot head also fits in it, so the rubbers are protected. The bucket doesn't take up much more room than the Big Shot head alone, so it really doesn't require a lot of additional space.

[No_Bivy]

good ole buckets..............nahhh:D

[rumination]

seems like the WIDE opening and the collapsable bag seem to be impotent for the tree dudes.

Speak for yourself.:P


The F-cube is most excellent. You will be very pleased with yours Brandon. The three gallon bucket is also extremely functional, but can lack a bit in the portability department if you have to hike your gear anywhere.

[Paul B]

I aint a tree dude..... just a landscraper that occasionally gets to play in trees. :P

[lumberjack]

John, I'm a Zinger.

Leon, I think it's spelled Brendon ;). Hope HK is treating you most excellently :)

[rumination]

Oops, sorry Brendon.

And yes HK is going well, thanks. Sister is coming to visit tomorrow and we'll take a trip into mainland China for a few days. It should be fun.

[MasterBlaster]

How is the language learning thing going? You learning, or blowing it off?

[lumberjack]

How's the other female(s) in your life?

[rumination]

My Cantonese is nonexistant, but my Mandarin is a tiny bit better which isn't saying much at all.

Carl, the Chinese girl friend is no more. Time for a new one.

[Ax-Man]

Hobby, my experience with a small bag for a throwline is if gets turned upside down or gets disturbed somehow from say a bonehead groundie the line tangles really bad when you go to use it. I tried one of those small bags from Sherrill when they first came out what a waste of money. This is when I switched to a plastic bucket or big food container in my case with a lid, no problems.

I am not saying it wouldn't work mind you. If you can make one stiff enough to stand upright and wide enough but still be able to fold down tight and lash it somehow to hold the line in place you might have something then.

Brian's bucket sounds good, Fran"s doggie bag looks promising. I am sure he wouldn't post it if he didn't think it was good. TM's idea has potential but to me could be refined a little for multiple throwball storage like the buckets or the f-cube have to offer.

The f-cube just isn't me because I don't do enough throwline type stuff for it to be that much use.

[OTGBOSTON]

another great think about the f-cube is that you can bring it aloft if need be. It can be clipped to a saddle opened or closed.

[Frans]

another great think about the f-cube is that you can bring it aloft if need be. It can be clipped to a saddle opened or closed.

For in-the-tree throwing I use a fly fishing reel. Holds about 50 feet of the smaller dia. zing it.

[rumination]

Do you have a picture of that reel setup Frans? I don't know anything about fishing so I don't know the difference between a fly fishing reel and any other kind of reel, or why one would work better than another for this application.

[Frans]

yes, but I am off to work real soon. Later I will post.

Gerry has some pix of his as well.

[Stumper]

Leon, I didn't have a pic of one of mine handy so I nicked one off ebay. This is Old technpology that has mostly fallen out of favor. A couple of companies make automatic reels still but the ones made 50 years ago are actually better. The principle is simple-A long recoil spring is housed in one side and transfers torque to the line spool via gearing so that you get multiple turns of line for each turn applied to the spring. The spring gets loaded as you pull line out and a dog/pawl or friction clutch capture the "progress". When you depress a lever on the front of the reel the line is wound back in. Most allow 40 feet or so to be pulled out and retracted in one winding but there are knurled rings on the outside of the reel.-One will disengage the tension on the spring without rewinding the line and the other allows you to tension the spring without affecting the line. Thus, if you store a 90 foot fly line and 50 feet of backing on the spool you can deal with all of it. Charley wagner showed up at the Masters 3 years ago with a modified steel tape case filled with throwline-I told him he needed an automatic flyreel. Tom Dunlap seconded that and incorporated it in his kit bag. I notice that Nick is using the idea also. I wouldn't be at all surprised if Frans came up with the idea on his own.Gerry Beranek has mentioned it too. It is pretty slick.
http://i11.ebayimg.com/03/i/000/cc/54/ad87_2.JPG

If you need one I can probably fix you up- I've restored a lot of them.

[Burnham]

Justin, could the same idea be applied to a Spencer logger's tape? A large one, designed for 75 or 100 foot tapes might have useable capacity, and the recoil spring is pretty strong. It might be somewhat heavier than the fly reel, but readily available. Most of the weight in a Spencer is the tape, anyway.

Edit: Doh, I see you mentioned that possibility already...

[Stumper]

Burnham, Sure. The advantage of the fly reel thouggh is that it automatically prevents rewind until triggered so you can pull off line for your throw, do your thing then trigger the rewind when desired.

[Burnham]

That sounds right, Justin...I can think of some ways to deal with that, but auto would be the best.

[brendonv]

Here's another pic.

http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c351/Brendonv/Gear/FlyReel.jpg

[brendonv]

http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c351/Brendonv/Gear/zingitholder.jpg

[Stumper]

The pics Brendon showed are of a manual fly reel-okay storage but NOT the same critter.

[Burnham]

I actually have one of those older auto retreive fly casting reels. But I inheirited it from my father and just can't bring myself to mess with it :(.

[Stumper]

Save that one and spend 10 or 15 bucks on Ebay for someone else's grandfather's reel. Some people have no heirs other's have ingrate children/grandchildren.

[rumination]

Thanks for the education Justin. I'd definitely like to try that out sometime. I'm guessing I'll have a hard time finding one of those reels in Hong Kong, so I'll wait on it until I'm back in the States this summer. Be ready for more questions then!

[gf beranek]

Exact same setup I been using for years. Though mine is a Phulger. The original pillers and screws long since fell out and have been replaced with off the shelf parts from the hardware store.

I'm surprised the frame has held up this long without being bent. It holds just a little over 60 feet of zing-it. Plenty good for up in the tree.

[MasterBlaster]

You're up early, Jerry! http://www.thecomputermechanics.com/forums/images/smilies/124.gif

[gf beranek]

3 o'clock is about normal for me. Was hoping I'd get out of the house today and go shoot some video, but it looks like I'll be stuck in doors.

[MasterBlaster]

Yeah, it looks like you're getting a bit of rain there.

[gf beranek]

There be snow at around 2,000 feet. It may drop down to sea level if it gets much colder.

[MasterBlaster]

Wow, and I almost need to crank my AC.

[gf beranek]

No kidding? And it's like 70 degrees in Kansas. Tornado warnings abound.

[No_Bivy]

3 o'clock is about normal for me.

:O

[MasterBlaster]

That's kinda early for me, too.

[Skwerl]

But that's just 6am Eastern time zone, I can dig it. 8) Fire up the coffee pot, I'm right there with ya!

[Tree Machine]

Click, click.

Can anybody hear me?



Hah-looooooooooo........

Mind if I pull up and have a beer?

[GASoline71]

Hey Jim!!!

Welcome aboard!!!

Good to see you here! :thumbup:

Gary

[Tree Machine]

Thanks Gary!


So what about that beer???

[Skwerl]

What the Hell took you so long? :P

Hey Jim! :D

[GASoline71]

I'd give ya that one in my avatar... but it is my last one.. ;)

LOL

Gary

[Tree Machine]

What the Hell took you so long?

I'm on vacation, not supposed to be hiding from my family behind the computer.

[Tree Machine]

But I'd be happy to have a brew and hang with you for awhile.

Hobby Climber, how bout one of those luscious cold Canadians?

[Tree Machine]

:surprise: WooHoo. Thanks, dude! :thumbup:

http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17483&stc=1&d=1199847311

[Skwerl]

Jim, I assume you're still in South Florida? Did you ever get over to see Brett or Kenny yet?

[Tree Machine]

If I could do two other thank you's before we dig in.....

Skwerl, thank you for summoning me in. And Beranek, thank you for "A Tree Story". That which you share through those CDs is absolutely remarkable. Just inspiring. If my head gets too big and i think I'm a hotshot climber, I put on "A Tree Story" and it lets me know who the hotshots really are. Also, I've had "General Fundamentals" for many years, and it is a timeless tree reference. I'd like to think I've contributed something to the Arboricultural community, but you, YOU SIR 8) are the big dog, head honcho, Grand poobah and illustrious magistrate. Thank you for inspiring all of us.

[Tree Machine]

Jim, I assume you're still in South Florida? Did you ever get over to see Brett or Kenny yet?
I'm still down here. In the last five days I've done 17 hours of (paid) tree work, went fishin all day yesterday enough to get just enough sunburn, and did concrete work most of today as part of my Christmas gift to my Sister.

Whew! I'm rather beat.

If Elizabeth wants to go to see some Frank Lloyd-Wright architecture in Lakeland, I'll call Tree Spyder.
If she want to go to Tampa and visit some botanical gardens east of town (Eureka Springs), or visit Busch Gardens, I may give Brett a call.

I want to go to Disney.

I have a feeling we're going to road trip down to the Keys and maybe I'd be lucky enough to meet VHarrison. The Keys are most likely. I mean, we love our family, but we need to break away so we can actually enjoy some true relaxation. The fact that I'm driving and transporting with us a saddle, rope, Silky Saw, pole pruners and a BigShot has her rather concerned.

[MasterBlaster]

Hey Jim, long time no see! You see where I damaged myself awhile back?

I guess you're all healed up???

[Tree Machine]

Hey Jim, long time no see! You see where I damaged myself awhile back?Hi Blaster. No I didn't. I hope you came out OK. Link me to the thread, I wannna know wasssup.


I came out a very, very lucky dude, Wicked, ugly scar, but no residual pain or climbing limitations of any sort. Power blower accident, I still feel like such an idiot, as many of us do after an avoidable accident. Actually, all accidents are avoidable, aren't they?

Still have never had an aerial accident of any kind, quite proud of that 14-year streak.

[Skwerl]

Here ya go Jim. I'll humor you until you get a chance to feel your way around the forum. ;)
http://www.gypoclimber.com/showthread.php?t=6286

[Hobby Climber]

Holly $hit...TM...how the heck are you?:)

Long time no hear!

Ya going to the '08 TCIA expo in WI ??? I am and will be bringing another package for you if you are!;)

Your a very informative fellow and you've made my climbing easier & more efficient. Because of your input on the "tree" sites, countless others have benefited as well. I take that knowledge learned from you (& others on the web) and apply it when aloft. You have made a difference...thank you sir!!!

Look forward to reading you often here in the TreeHouse!

All the best to you in 2008,



Bob (aha- HobbyClimber)


PS- ..and don't forget to check you blind side Eh!:P

[pantheraba]

Hey, TM, really glad to have you around. You were my voice of reality and helpfulness when I was down at Katrina and I really appreciate you helping like you did.

Your constant willingness to offer your ideas and experiences to others when I first bumped into you at AS really impressed me...enough that I still remember you and am glad to read you again.

Just sit down here on the log beside me and we'll watch the campfire and tell stories. :)

[Tree Machine]

Thanks, Pantheraba.

Thanks Skwerl.

Ohhhhhhh, The Crushing of the Blaster,
Butch, I am so sorry. 44 stitches to put the sole of your foot back onto the side of your foot.... ahh, ahh, oWWwwwWWWW!!!

Your a very informative fellow and you've made my climbing easier & more efficient. Because of your input on the "tree" sites, countless others have benefited as well. I take that knowledge learned from you (& others on the web) and apply it when aloft. You have made a difference...thank you sir!!!
Thanks for the fine compliment, Hobby Climber. We all have unique skills, and we all share with each other. That's what makes Arbo forum sites such special places.

Hi Pantheraba, incredible hero of the Katrina cleanup. Talk about a dude who inspired thousands of us by going to the front lines during the hurricane cleanup....and helped so many desperate folks get the trees off their homes, at no charge. There's a place for you in heaven, Mister Pantheraba.

[Paul B]

welcome Tree Machine.

be careful now fellas, i get the feeling a hug picture is about to surface! :\:

[Stumper]

Hi Jim!



NO NEAR NAKED MUTUAL MALE HUGGING!!!!!!!! PLEEEEEEEASE!

[xtremetrees]

Hey TM, good to read ya. As I was banned from the other tree site I've missed learning from a soloist aloft like myself. Tyvm for teaching me how to untie my own knot. I went 10 years having to re climb trees! Thanks to you no more of that. Unlike the other sites these folks as you can figure are about as real as it gets, honest, sincere and down right to the point about what they think about ones writing.

Where do I get this great invention it seems most effectient method on the market today? of not only deploring throw line but also stowing the line. It looks like a water hose reel cut in half.

[Tree Machine]

Think 'extension cord reel'.

More tonight,
I will disclose all. I just spent an hour compiling pictures of this reel from the last 7 year of various incarnations.

Xtreme, It is not available, but I will show you how to make one. I will ask for one small agreement from the community, then I'll spill the beans.

There have been questions up to this point, I will quote and answer them all. Any more questions, post them here and now.

Cheers!

-TM-

[Bounce]

I'm looking forward to seeing your pictures, as I'm awfully tired of stuffing my line.

[OTGBOSTON]

Hey TM good to read you again! I was wonderin' what happened to you:/:

Speaking of wich, any one heard from climb020 (Doug)?

[Tree Machine]

Here goes. I have like 300 pictures of this reel in its development, dating back to 2001. You'll see a select number of the different variations, all leading up to 2008 where it's now quite refined.

Interestingly enough, I got it right the first time, with the first reel. In trying to improve upon that, I failed a good number of times before coming around to what's been done as of this writing.


Before we go on, let me speak personally to all of you.

I've developed this reel for our Arboricultural community, as there is practically no other use for it that I can think of. Hundreds of hours have been applied in the research and development of it, thousands have been spent on different reel types, different line types, and the intellectual property attorneys, working with the patent artist, not to mention a lot of time away from work pursuing manufacturing options and capturing images and shooting and editing video.

The reel is not patented at this time. Anyone who has been through this meticulous and time-consuming system understands the expenses and I just had to look at how many reels would have to be sold, at what price, to achieve even a break-even. This is before even going into the manufacturing process, in which the kindest company I talked to told me they would not create an injection die for under a 10,000 unit run. The price for that,...... uhhh....:O

[Tree Machine]

So, before I bankrupted myself, or made it so a reel would cost you a hundred and twenty bucks, I stopped short of a full patent filing. There's a registration, the attorney told me what that provides, but by then I was numb and just wanted to take my bleeding checkbook and go home.

Trust me, I think I did us a favor.


My sharing fully with you may seem like giving away the farm. The patent exercise was because no one wants to dedicate his time and money in creating and developing his original idea, just to have it stolen and capitalized on by the first scum dog who sees it.

We're a tight community, worldwide. I am presenting this valuable tool, at this point, out of love, as I'm not selling it (will explain as we move along).

My intent is to BRING it to the front, where our collective minds can cooperate in its further development. I'm humble enough to accept that I can't do it alone, and money isn't my driving motivation. Benefit to the arboricultural community is the motivation. I just ask that, if you have an earnest desire to aid in the manufacture, just call me. I want nothing more than for Arborists to enjoy the use of this time and effort-saving device.

[Tree Machine]

For Arborists to enjoy the use of this time and effort-saving device, you will need to build one yourself, and I encourage you to do so.

If you do it the way I describe it, you will have excellent, flawless results as I do. If you change design, it could be better, it could be worse, but it won't be as described, so it will simply be some modified offshoot of the idea. If you have poor results, you're not allowed to come forward and complain about the performance as an apple does not, and will not taste like an orange.


The reason I say this is I have had crappy designs and poor results, I will share with you those pictures.

All this will be the foundation for a commercial reel that can be sold through our Arbo distributors. You are all now officially on the design committee.

Let's get started.

[Tree Machine]

http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17515&stc=1&d=1199942310
http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17516&stc=1&d=1199942310
http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17517&stc=1&d=1199942310

First image, June 2001, with my first BigShot, introduced at the TCIA Expo just 6 months earlier. Shotline management BEGGED for a solution, though the problem then was not just how to stow the line, but the line itself. Thick polypropylene 'slickline', this stuff just SUCKED.

The second picture: Here's a closeup of the original first reel, the flange surface covered in duct tape, a natural stage for ANY invention, in my opinion. Without the tape, I feared it would not withstand the upcoming 'run over it with the truck' test, a necessary test, given that groundguys set things in front of vehicles and then drive into, or over them :pathetic:. I think you all know what I mean.

Third pic: Here is the reel AFTER the 'run over it with a truck' test. The duct tape held it together, but I lost a chip out of the top. The reel lived on and did hundreds of shots before I loaned it to an apprentice for the weekend and never saw it again.

[Tree Machine]

Ah-HA! This is a picture of the very original first reel, before the duct taping.

What I did was take an extension cord reel, and simply cut off one side so that the yellow disk I'd just cut off was flush with the black inner drum. I soon found that polishing that upper circumference, a light sanding with sandpaper and a light going-over with a propane torch to melt out the sanding marks helped a lot.

From this alone, you can go make one tomorrow.

This extension cord reel was made by a company called Woods. How appropriate. They're the ones that gave me the quote of minimum 10,000 units to even talk, but that was years after making this one.

At this time I just wanted to streamline the shotline deployment, retrieval and stowage. The headache of stuffing line into bags and pouches curdled my cerebrospinal fluid one too many times. Faltemeiers were not out yet. Fishing reels proved futile, bowhunting reels some promise, but too small a diameter drum. I had no alternatives but to take a stab at something that plain did not exist in our industry.

The slots in the yellow disc allowed it to be clipped on the saddle with a biner.
http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17526&stc=1&d=1199953140

http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17518&stc=1&d=1199943539

[Tree Machine]

http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17519&stc=1&d=1199944468


Oh how we suffered with this early polypro line.

It did poor-to-OK if you tossed by hand, but the BigShot hated it.

[Tree Machine]

http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17520&stc=1&d=1199945340

Notice how this reel is different. I cut off the one side, same as the yellow model, but notice how the internal handle does not span across the inside. Rather, it floats along the side of the internal curve as you reel it.

This design just did NOT work well, but I thought it could with further modification.

[Tree Machine]

http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17521&stc=1&d=1199945769

So I further modified it.

Duct tape was out of the question. I needed plumber's epoxy and wood.

This attempt was to get the handle more centered so it could be reeled in faster, as the side slide way it was proved to be very clumsy and the reel would wobble, not allowing you to reel the line exactly where you wanted it.

This mod did not work and I only made two or three of these varients before seeking out a different style reel.

[Tree Machine]

http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17522&stc=1&d=1199946251

This reel came from an electrician. It was a spool for copper wire.

The thought was to use a retractable fat dowel that would fit in the center, and pop out for use, creating a side handle. Sounded great in theory. The actual performance sucked so bad I didn't even bother to take photos.

A major learning mistake was encountered, though, making the effort worth the effort: I cut off the one side, the horizontal side plate, flush with the vertical drum. In other words, there was no 'lip' at the top, just a cylinder on a plate. When you fired a shot, a NUMBER of winds would peel off at once, rather than one wind at a time in rapid sequence. When multiple winds come off at once, a tangle is an absolute promise.

Up til now, the lip had been an unintentional aspect of the design. From then on, it would be viewed as a critical component.

On to the next.

[Tree Machine]

Some of you may notice I have a mini hotwire biner as part of the setup.
This is only because I have put eye terminations in all my ropes since very early in my arbo career. When the shotline and bag come down out of the tree, I like to drop the bag, clip on the rope and GO. There's no faster way possible.

Once the rope has been set, unclip the rope, clip on the bag and REEL. My attempt has always been to make this last part as fast as possible while applying the line so that the next shot is flawless and perfect, right off the reel.

[Tree Machine]

http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17524&stc=1&d=1199948674

As well as the different reels, I was trying different bags and different lines.

The line in this image, whatever it was, sucked, until it got wet and then it horribly sucked.

Some of the bags I used also sucked, big pickle-shaped torpedo things, fine and dandy for hand-tossing, but lousey for the BigShot. And then there were really good ones, nice compact shape, good for tossing or firing but they would puff out lead dust after a few hundred slams back to earth.

The shotline winder development naturally coursed through the trials of a LOT of different bag styles and types, as well as different shotlines.

I've spent a small fortune.

[Tree Machine]

At this point, several years have elapsed. I went to buy another of the original yellow extension cord reels because I was tired of trying and testing other types and styles. Through all this time and effort, the original yellow one stood out.

Zing-it line was now on the market and I wanted to try this former good reel with this new fabulous line. I went to the hardware store, and they were out of them. I described the extension cord reel, and yea, they were familiar with it but said they hadn't seen it in awhile. They said the company was Woods, and they showed me where it had been. In it's place, a new style reel, much like one that had failed earlier on. So I took down the number of the Woods company off that reel, went home and called them. OUT OF PRODUCTION. That's when I asked about them custom-making a finished shotline reel for us, e-mailed him pictures and followed up and all. that's when we got the mnimum 10,000 unit schpeel. They really didn't want to touch a product that couldn't be mass-produced and distributed through their channels. OK, fair enough.

But I was out of an excellent raw reel.
http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17525&stc=1&d=1199950196

[Tree Machine]

So now it's an obsession, the search for the ideal reel.

Spring, 2005, I was traveling with Elizabeth on a roadtrip and we stopped into this "Tools Tarps Gloves" place about 400 Km from home. Wouldn't you know it? There was one that looked promising. Knowing I wouldn't be back there any time soon, I asked for their business card, took a chance and bought ten.

The instinct was spot-on! This reel was much like the original yellow one, but it was black. I made one and it worked GREAT! I used it for a couple months, then had a little altercation with a stump grinder. Let's fast-forward to November, when I was just again able to sort of walk

With the 2005 TCIA expo upcoming, I rented a booth space on the expo floor so us forum guys would have a place to meet. I made two reels the day before, put them together kinda fast, and got my butt to Columbis, Ohio.

Real shortly after hitting the expo floor, I met Koa Man, and Hobby Climber. Our forum booth was right next to the spider lift guys. That afternoon I watched Koa Man carve out a check for $45,000 for a new lift. Of course, I asked to take a ride up as I'd never been in any sort of manlift, spider lift or bucket truck up to that point. They said no. I said, "Sir, I need to shoot a video for Mr. Koa Man's wife." I stood there with my video cam. Koa stood back, silent, a wistful smile on his face. They obliged me.

(I tried posting the 2.6 meg video without success)

[Tree Machine]

So Koa and I got together after the expo floor closed and went and had dinner. I'm with this legendary Arborist, sitting at the same table, Britney Spears or God could have walked in and I wouldn't have even noticed. I mean, this was the actual Koa Man!

So during dinner, Britney comes up and tries to seduce me, and I'm like, "Look chick, I'm having dinner with the Koa Man." Then God walks up, I'm like, "Dude, can't you see I'm busy?"

Some people! :lol:


Anyway, cutting through to the end, I'm feeling like Koa has traveled one HECK of a long way to the middle of the US heartland, and dropped a monster wad of cash earlier on his new toy and I just wanted to offer a gift, so I put this shotline reel in his hands.

http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17527&stc=1&d=1199953403

[Tree Machine]

If you look closely at his reel above, you'll notice that the top plate that was cut off, I then adhered back to the underside. I was just trying different things. The curvature of one side was identical to the other, so nesting and gluing them together should make the base plate more durable, add some heft, possibly give me a good place to put these otherwise useless cutoff tops.

Something about that incarnation still wasn't right. The little handle on the underside made the whole reel tilt. What if I didn't want tilt, like when stowing the unit away? It would just be better flat.

On the next one, I planned to adhere the base plate the same as Koa Man's, but first I would drill a series of pencil-diameter holes from the inside edge to the outside edge, THEN glue the two together. Remove the crank handle. Now it would lay flat and by using a small stick, the stick became the crank and by sticking it in any one of the various holes, you could change the diameter of rotation and thus the speed of the reeling; the closer in, the faster.http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17528&stc=1&d=1199955619

[Tree Machine]

I'm still not happy with it. The extra bulk of the base plate was not an advantage, but it was not a disadvantage either that I could sense. But as far as compact stowing, that big baseplate was too big in diameter. I started cutting them down, making the overall size smaller by cropping the baseplate.

Now we had a smaller baseplate with no crank handle. I drilled holes to accomodate the stick as a handle, but if the stick protruded through, it would interfere with the line being winded. I adhered a metal ring, creating a slightly raised profile, but you could use the same stick as a handle. That worked, but it STILL didn't seem quite right.

Back to the drawing board, I still had 5 or 6 extension cord reels left, keep trying.

Somewhere in this era I was introduced to the Harrison Rocket, a MAGNIFICENT shot bag, great throwing profile, excellent shooting shape and the lead shot is encased inside a bladder within and then the cordura cover is sewn around that. No more lead dust poofs and toxic gray powder grunge.

http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17529&stc=1&d=1199956157

[Tree Machine]

The line is excellent, the bag is excellent, the new compact size is cool, this thing has evolved, but it's still not quite right. I can't put my finger on it. The metal depression ring is hokey, the Arborist is expected to come up with a stick every time he wants to wind the reel. I just knew we could do better.

So I was on vacation, this time, last year. Over time I'd assembled enough tree gear in Florida so that when I come down to visit, I've got the basics; saddle, rope, Silky saws. My Dad has chainsaws. On the trip down I decided to add a shotline winder to the vacation arsenal. I showed it to Dad, told him I was trying to solve the problem of being able to wind up the reel, easily and with lightning speed, without having a crank handle sticking out and I don't want to have to find the ideal stick every time the reel needs reeling. He looked, thought for half a second and said, "Fishing swivel", turned and got a tackle box and the problem, for all practical purposes, was solved.
http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17531&stc=1&d=1199958124

[Tree Machine]

But the base was too small. After thousands of uses, the natural feeling was to take the bag in hand, and toss the reel, like a light frisbee throw, to somehere just out in front of your feet. With the smaller profile, it would sometimes hit the ground and roll over.

Now, I know this is a miniscule detail in the overall picture, but we're on a mission here. I know some day I'm gonna have to get up in front of the online Arbo world and give something akin to a formal presentation and after, you're gonna hammer me with questions. Any missed detail will be scrutinized, you're gonna put me through the wringer on this and I want to be ready for that day.

I just didn't think today was going to be the day.

So back to the base being now too small. Also, I didn't care for the original big base as it had that curvature to it, and triangular holes. I really liked the smaller base, but mostly because it was flat. I wanted a wider base, for it to be flat and to add structure and strength to the reel. It should also be attractive

So how to make it flat. Glue it to something round and flat, duh. That something needs to be flat, light and indestructable. Hmmmm, carbon fiber graphite? Too expensive. Plastic?.....which?

I came up with polycarbonate, the stuff they use on the roofs of greenhouses, corru-plas I've heard it called when you make yard signs out of it. I happened to have had some scrap of that around, so I glued the small base to it. Nice. I can flip it like a frisbee and it lands and stays the way it should. And the swivel worked great!
http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17532&stc=1&d=1199959326
http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17533&stc=1&d=1199960212

[Tree Machine]

I quickly went to make another one, while I was still inspired and on an improvement roll.

On the next one I needed to solve two more things. 1. the swivel on this last model came all the way up through the polycarbonate and was secured by a piece of ziptie. We can do better than that, think, c'mon, this should be a no brainer.....got it! On the underside, make a tiny slice in the polycarbonate, in between and perpindicular to the ribs. Slip the swivel in there, put a thin skewer stick into the rib channel and through the swivel loop where you'd normally tie your fishing line. Add a touch of adhesive to keep the skewer stic from moving. Done.

Problem 2. how to pack the shotbag away in the handle compartment so the line won't come unwound and the shotbag won't fall out of the handle compartment, like when the reel gets jostled around or dumped out of the tool bin. Here's the pic of the solution:
http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17535&stc=1&d=1199960680
http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17534&stc=1&d=1199960680

[Tree Machine]

Right about this time, Tobe Sherrill comes out with an improved model BigShot (Picture above). But wait there's more, the new Sherrill shotbags, exact replicates of the Harrison Rocket in dayglo orange, now in 14 and 16 ounce sizes. Holy Crapinoli!
http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17536&stc=1&d=1199961143

[Tree Machine]

So that's about where it is right now, folks. New England has come out with a lime fluorescent green shotline that is the same as our familiar ZingIt, so we've got 3 cool colors of line, cool, world class bags, new and improved BigShot.... it is just a great time in history to be a treeguy.
http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17537&stc=1&d=1199961478

[Tree Machine]

Ladies and gents, it is 6 am right now. I started this at 11 pm. I truly hope it hasn't taken you 7 hours to read it. I think I have said all there is to say. I hope I have answered the bulk of the questions you may have had.


Last thing before I go crash.

I called the "Tools Tarps and Gloves" place a couple months back and asked what the price might be for a hundred of the black electrical cord reels (I was just curious). He said he's sold out of them the week before, and when ordering more learned that there were no more in stock from his distributor. He wouldn't be carrying them anymore :?


Interesting scenario, eh? :cry:

I have three left, two made-up and one last unconverted cord reel. I apologise. They're not for sale.

Thank you, those of you who made it through the last 20 or so posts. You deserve a reading endurance award.

Questions?

[pantheraba]

Thank you, those of you who made it through the last 20 or so posts. You deserve a reading endurance award.

Questions?

Jim, I am flabbergasted...wonderful presentation. I am headed out to work and will have to let this digest some and come back and read it again.

Thanks for taking time to share the process of your development with us...that is a well documented evolution.

I am looking forward to getting back later to read further. Get some rest, mister.

[Frans]

I have a couple of questions. But first thank you for sharing your idea with us.
I just might have to make one of these.
1. When you reel in the line, how does the line 'fairlead' onto the drum? It seems like you need two hands to operate the drum itself.
One hand to hold the inner handle in the middle of the spool, and one hand to hold the handle/fishing swivel.
Do you stand lightly on the throw line in order to keep tension on the throwline as you wind it up?

If there was some way to attach the reel to your body, then you could hold the line as you reel it in.

Am I making sense?

2.How far out does the lip on the edge of the spool extend? Looks about maybe 1/8" from the photos?

I am thinking that the round collapsable storage bins would be great for stowing this device. The 'f'-cube would not be the best for storage as the reel could move about.
But if the line is secured tightly by the throw line being jammed into the inner handle of the reel, maybe a storage bag is not necessary unless you need to store multiple extra bags as well.

Thanks again. Looking forward to your replies.

[Burnham]

Outstanding presentation, Jim. Now I have to keep my eyes open for reels. Can you give some dimensions you think are about right for the spool?

[sotc]

very nice job! can we see i pic of how the swivel is attached?

[Koa Man]

Jim,
Sure glad to have you here and see that you are still on your mission to invent and improve. The shot reel you gave me works just fne for me. I see no need for it to lay flat and neither is the handle or the spring clip I use to hold the bag a problem. I don't have any need to carry a throw bag once I am in the tree. Trees here are generally more wide than tall and crotches are not that far apart. I just wish I had started using it earlier, but I packed up my house stuff shortly after I met you and had almost everything in a 16 and a 24 ft. storage container. It has only been a few months since I unpacked everything and started using the reel and it works just great. Thanks again for giving it to me, I really appreciate it.

Hopefully one day you will be able to visit Hawaii.

[xtremetrees]

I agree with panther I am flabergasted too bro. You did all this wrote all this compiled and presented all this for me. I think you understand altruism very well and self sacrafice has got to amusing to ya!. What a great read. You're certainly the throwball king round this joint!

[Hobby Climber]

TM,

Great post!


About your other issue...this may help! :P www.americaninsomniaassociation.org/aboutaia.htm

Later,

HC

[NickfromWI]

I have an idea on how you could terminate/secure the end of the throwline during storage, but let me wait until I get home. I'd like to draw it out for you.

love
nick

[NickfromWI]

Oh, and I know exactly what you're talking regarding getting the patent and all that stuff. It is mentally and financially exhausting. Everyone I talked to would tell me something else I had to do to get a patent (for some slack tenders I was working on). I too eventually gave up, realizing that I would have to sell them for more than double what a CMI mini pulley would cost.

love
nick

[Tree Machine]

Nick Araya, how the heck goes it? I'm still enjoying those dual-leg, three-eye hybrid cords for backing up the dual ascenders. I've still never had the duals fail, so your creation has never gotten much in the way of a workout, but the system works.

Thanks for further acknowledging the folly of the patent process. It's very deflating, both to the wallet and the inspiration. Then there's no guarantee the patent will hold up internationally.

For me to take this reel to market is truly prohibitively expensive and time-consuming. I really don't want to compromise my day job over it.

The way I see this happening is one of you has an uncle or someone you know in the plastics business. You show him this thread. He says, "Yea, I can build a die for that. We can pump out 500 of these a day for $X each." He makes us a garageload of them, we get a 10,000 foot reel of ZingIt line. Your 12 year-old brother winds a hundred eight feet of line onto each, inserts a swivel, a half a skewer stick, a dob of adhesive, done. The reel is done. The extreme end user (aka Treeguy) chooses his own preferred shotbag, mini biner as his personal option. It just doesn't have to be complex to get a reasonably priced, high-quality shotline reel to market.

We share this information with a representative of a fine and reputable Arborist supply, like Wesspur :hello2: and we get 'r dun.

I am still amazed there is not one on the market yet. There's only been topical discussions on the buzz and AS.

I showed the yellow model to Tobe Sherrill at the TCIA Expo, Milwaukee 5 or 6 years ago. He held it in his own hands, said "Keep me informed." Now, he could have taken and developed the idea as it is a natural companion to his BigShot. But he hasn't, and for that I respect him greatly.
http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17543&stc=1&d=1200022053

[Tree Machine]

You did all this wrote all this compiled and presented all this for me.True, and thank you, X, for sharing it with everyone else.
I have an idea on how you could terminate/secure the end of the throwline during storage, but let me wait until I get home. I'd like to draw it out for you.Careful now. I've worked really hard to keep this thing as absolutely simple as possible. All along the way I've tried to keep it boiled down to the least common denominator. It's easy to make things hard, but it's harder to keep things easy.

[Tree Machine]

There's only been topical discussions on the buzz and AS.I get around. I went to tbuzz and tried once again unsuccessfully to re-register and join the conversation. Didn't happen. There was a shotline thread at AS a few years back, I was describing how to make one, the questions stopped. I don't generally like to monologue, so I waited for more input. There was none. The thread died.

Tom Dunlap came down to Indianapolis the Summer before last, stayed at my home for a couple nights, we worked part of a day together. Later on I sent him a couple gifts, a loaded shotline winder (line, bag and all) and a bar clamping device for sharpening chains. I even melted DUNLAP into the plastic on the handle of the reel with a hotknife.

Both gifts he sent back with a thank you note and that he had his own way of doing things. That is true, no doubt. I could tell by the way I had reeled it up, it had not even been used.

If there is another Dunlap out there, I will sell that reel to you.

(Also, keep any negative Tom comments to yourself, he's my friend)

[Tree Machine]

Jim,
The shot reel you gave me works just fine for me. I see no need for it to lay flat and neither is the handle or the spring clip I use to hold the bag a problem. Thanks again for giving it to me, I really appreciate it.Your testimony gave this thread the wings to fly. I do want you to go over the top lip area with fine sandpaper, and then a light flaming with a propane torch on low. It's important for this rim to be totally smooth and rounded over for the 70 - 80 foot BigShots right off the reel. Not as critical on shorter shorts


Hopefully one day you will be able to visit Hawaii.Ummm, yes, of course:big-tongue4: http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17545&stc=1&d=1200024578

[Frans]

TreeMachine, could you answer my questions?

[Tree Machine]

Ahhh, yes. I was going to get to that, Frans.

You posed the primary question, one that is so easily and instantly answered with video, but I will do so in words for the moment. You asked, hang on, give me a minute......
I have a couple of questions. But first thank you for sharing your idea with us.
I just might have to make one of these.
1. When you reel in the line, how does the line 'fairlead' onto the drum? It seems like you need two hands to operate the drum itself.
One hand to hold the inner handle in the middle of the spool, and one hand to hold the handle/fishing swivel.
Do you stand lightly on the throw line in order to keep tension on the throwline as you wind it up?

If there was some way to attach the reel to your body, then you could hold the line as you reel it in.

Am I making sense?Perfect sense, excellent question. This is the reason the reel evolved from having a stationary handle, to using sticks as cranks to the fishing swivel. It is about the 'fairleading' or the accurate rewinding of the line back on to the spool.

Yes, you use two hands, no other way around that. Proper line tension is required, you sensed that. And reeling the line on in a manner that it will deploy without fail, every single time, is of utmost importance. This is easy to achieve, I'll explain.

First thing, when winding the reel, you don't want it to wobble left-right. When using the factory crank handle, as in Koa's model, the handle far to the outside of the big-diameter bottom plate requires that you keep your inner handle hand stationary, and your winding hand winds; that hand's wrist remains straight, and your hand, straight wrist and forearm move in a circle with the pivot point at your elbow.

I want everyone to try this. Make a fist with your left hand, hold it out in front of your chest, knuckles pointing to the right. Take your left hand, place it out front facing your left knuckles. Grasp the imaginary handle. Hold your right wrist stiff, now wind slowly, in dinner plate-diameter circles around your left hand. Note the pivot point being more or less at your elbow, some bicep motion and maybe a bit of shoulder motion. No problem. Now wind really fast.

Notice now that your left hand moves (the whole reel moves) and the motion in your entire right arm, bicep, shoulder; it's all erratic.

The stationary crank handle on the large-diameter base plate almost requires that you go slow to fairlead the line onto the reel accurately.

Now try this, same knuckle fist, left hand out front. This time, imagine the diameter of the base plate to be that of a smaller saucer dish. Instead of a stationary handle, imagine the fishing swivel. And this time DO NOT KEEP YOUR WRIST STRAIGHT. Your wrist is a flexible ball joint, as is the fishing swivel. Crank slowly around your left knuckles, perfect circles, keep your forearm and elbow stiff and stationary, all the motion of cranking comes from your wrist. Now speed it up. Now go as fast as you can.

An amazing difference, isnt there? You're able to keep the left knuckle hand perfectly stationary, even at top cranking speed.

You will not need to force a top-speed reel-in. 3/4 speed and focus on smooth cranking and non-wobbly inner handle hand.

[Tree Machine]

Now the actual heart of the question that Frans put's forth, how do you keep that ideal tension? Simple. Take the reel in hand, step over the line with the flaked line BEHIND you. Bring your thighs together creating light pressure on the line. You don't need much pressure, just enough to create a consistent, light taughtness of the line between the front of your thighs and the reel.

This tensioning issue is identically the same with then Koa handle, but it took the transition from Koa handle to swivel to shift the swiftness into full joy. Firing the shot straight off the reel is part of the amazement, but this swift retrieval back on to the reel is really where it's at, as far as efficient shotline management.


I am thinking that the round collapsable storage bins would be great for stowing this device.The reel is self-stowing in and of its own self. I've never put it in a bag, though I guess you could. It holds one shot bag, interchangable of course.

I keep two reels in the truck, my Steady Eddie with a 12 oz bag, the other with 14. I'm running 1.75 mm ZingIt on both, at the moment.

When the bag-end of the line gets worn, I mean like after 3 or 4 or 500 shots, reverse the line. The formerly worn portion is now the first to go on the spool and when fully wound, you now have essentially brand new line at the business end.


2.How far out does the lip on the edge of the spool extend? Looks about maybe 1/8" from the photos?This area, I have not adjusted at all in the history of its existance. Other than the non-lip experience of the copper wire spool, this lip aspect has remained unchanged. Here's why:

The inner handle drum goes inside the reel drum, extends through just a bit and curves over. This curve-over lip keeps the inner druum from sliding out of the outer drum. This is factory. When I cut the outer plate off, I cut it using the factory lip as the guide, sand smooth and then fire polish. If you look close, it is not a lip, it is two lips, one that spins and the other stationary. But yes, they're about 3-4 mm out from the drum. The reason I've never tweaked this area is bacause never more than one revolution of line comes off at once, nor has the lip ever seemed to be obstructive in any way.



Thanks again. Looking forward to your replies. Thank you for asking.

[Tree Machine]

How far out does the lip on the edge of the spool extend? Looks about maybe 1/8" from the photos?



Outstanding presentation, Jim. Now I have to keep my eyes open for reels. Can you give some dimensions you think are about right for the spool?


very nice job! can we see i pic of how the swivel is attached?

All three of these, answered in this picture:http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17557&stc=1&d=1200030070

[NickfromWI]

My idea came from seeing the version with the clamp securing the end of the line and bag to the reel for storage/transport. I saw that clamp and thought...well...I'll be polite:P

Anyway- I was thinking there's got to be a way to clean that up a bit. If there were small notches, maybe a 1/4" deep or less and just thick enough for the throwline to slide in. Then you have a pocket built into the handle, or you could just wrap the line around the handle like I showed in the picture.

This pic kinda shows what I mean.

And I'm doing quite well, thank you. Just got a promotion a few months ago! :thumbup:

love
nick

[Tree Machine]

Fabulous, Nick!

Koa Man, when you fire-polish your rim lip, add a few notches and touch them with the flame, too.

That idea is great for the earlier Koa version. I have since then gone to cutting off the second plate (which was concave to the ground) and replacing it with FLAT plastic, continuous all the way across the bottom plate. By cutting a shotbag-diameter hole in that new plate, within the drum, you use notches in the periphery of the outer plate, just as you described.

Instead of calling them notches, let's call them 'nicks'. Since you brought it up, we'll call them 'Nick's nicks'.

http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17558&stc=1&d=1200030838

[Tree Machine]

It is almost 2 am. I accidentally woke Elizabeth when I crawled in at 6 this morning. She was not very compassionate and had me up before 10.

I haven't pulled an all-nighter in a long time, it's sort of nice to know it can still be done without chemical assistance. I thank you for that. And thanks for the insomnia link, Hobby Climber.

And really, I thank you all for your interest. This project is special to me, and I've felt sort of guilty keeping it from our community for so long.

Getting this all out on the table has been cathartic and therapeautic. I've been holding it inside for a long, long time and to be very honest, it feels very good to let it go.

[Stumper]

Cool stuff.
Hey Jim, I have Dunlap's disease.... but the swelling is going down.

[NickfromWI]

Nick's nicks?

I'm honored....


NOW GO TO BED!!!!

[sotc]

cool, i now see the inserted stick and under stand, thanks

[The Branch Doctor]

Awesome idea Jim. I'm a little throwline improvement obsessed myself and I think it's genius for it's simplicity while still performing. I'm gonna make one for myself (hell yeah). Thank you very much for sharing your adventure in creating the ultimate reel with us..... straight up dude, it's genius.:thumbup:



Stumpy brought up an automatic fly fishing reel as a tool for when aloft. I made one a couple years ago and posted pics of it here. I'm not in the mood to look up the thread so I'll just throw the pics back up.

[Ax-Man]

Again, excellent presentation TM. Impressive :thumbup: :thumbup:

Your thread also got me stirred up for a better way to manage a throwline. I had some time yesterday to go reel shopping so to speak at the hardware stores to see if I could modify a off the shelf reel. The offerings were very poor compared to your streamlined version. I took one look at some reels and just left it at that.

Yesterday also found me at our Morbark dealer to finish up some business. I bought one of those cheap Chinese folding cubes for 15 bucks just to try one. For my needs this will work for the short term. The cheap folding cube will solve my storage problem that has been a pain using plastic buckets. How that cube will work on the job will be another test.

Gotta question for you TM .

Did this quest your on for perfecting a smooth deployment reel evolve from using a BigShot verses plain old hand throwing. Is there a different need in the line deployment department using a BigShot that a reel is better compared to having line coming out of a bucket. Or does it really matter ??? I dunno because I don't have a BigShot.

I really have to admire your determination to follow through on your project and be able to create something that your happy with or at least you seem to be.

Good work and looks great

[Tree Machine]

Gotta question for you TM .

Did this quest your on for perfecting a smooth deployment reel evolve from using a BigShot verses plain old hand throwing. Is there a different need in the line deployment department using a BigShot that a reel is better compared to having line coming out of a bucket. Or does it really matter ??? I dunno because I don't have a BigShot.
Answer to your first sentence, No. I was on this before the BigShot came to market, having used pouch bags, leather purses from the thrift shop, buckets, etc.

I throw more than I BigShot and the reel works equally well for both. I pull the BigShot only when I'm over 40 feet or so.

[No_Bivy]

Can you post some video of it deploying using the big shot?

[Hobby Climber]

[QUOTE=Tree Machine;196998]
I don't generally like to monologue, ...
-----------------------------------

TM,
Your kidding us right!:P Haha

A most excellent post for sure you ol insomniac you!

HC

[Tree Machine]

OK, this thread is the mother of all monologues, but I was basically given the ball and told to run. This one wasn't for me, it was for the team.

Like Axeman has done, I hope that many others of you scope out the electrical section of your hardware store for a good shotline reel candidate, one that has an internal handle that goes across the center.

Kite reels don't work, they're a different principal and a smaller diameter. A smaller diameter may work with smaller line, but the 1.75 mm is about as small as our shotline lines get. I feel the diameter of the reels I've shown you are as small a diameter as you would want to go. A bigger diameter could work as well, or better.
Can you post some video of it deploying using the big shot?Yes. I think. Quite boring, though. You'll see the bigShot go off and the reel unwind, but in that sort of clip you won't see how high the shot was or anything because the camera can only be on the reel, or the tree, not both. When you're the shooter, you see both, but to be honest, from the shooter's standpoint, the gratifying part is watching the shotbag sail up and over a 70-foot limb.

If you overshoot, step on the reel. Gently set down your pole. Take the line and trace it back down--hey, that's another cool benefit, stopping the reel instantly and hands-free, that way the bag doesn't drop so far that you have to pull it back up much of a distance, nor do you have to drop your pole on the ground in a hurried manner to grab the line. It's all pretty smooth.
http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17593&stc=1&d=1200176646

[Tree Machine]

Oh, but back to Bivy's question about the video; it DOES show the rewinding of the line, the placement of the line into the Nick's nick, putting the bag into the through-hole and back over the handle, which takes about as long to view it as it took for you to read this post.







Hey Branch Doctor, excellent use of the Freino Biner on keeping your fly reel setup together.
Very nice!

[Tree Machine]

MastaBlasta, anything I should know about posting video here in this thread?
http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17595&stc=1&d=1200179685

[Paul B]

you should be able to embed youtube vids here Treemachine, just use the embed code that youtube gives you. :)

[MasterBlaster]

Yep, nothing to it.

[Tree Machine]

I've never done You-tube. Watched a lot of them, but have never posted anything.



So, what's the scoop on posting video to your server, Blasta?
They're in Quicktime format, under 4 meg, I kept em small knowing the only time I would ever need them would be to eventually post them for Arborists.

Here's a couple streaming videos of Arbo stuff I have on an independent server, to see if things come through. I don't have shotline reel footage there, but I could put it up there if these test pieces work. The downside is, if I ever pull the plug on the server, the videos get pulled off of the post. If I submit them to the Blaster server, they're here permanently unless Blaster pulls them.



TEST, Nick from Wisconsin's tenex sling and the Bull Hitch (http://treeguy.info/videos/nicks_hitch_music.mov)


TEST, Tree Machine tuning a Silky Saw (turn up the volume) (http://treeguy.info/videos/silky/silky_top_gun.mov)

See if these come up.

[Paul B]

its easy peezy. just register there, up your vid and wait a couple minutes. then get the embed code and paste it here. nothing to it.

[MasterBlaster]

nothing to it.


Again I say. Just start an account, you'll be glad you did.

[Tree Machine]

I will have to do it later. I'm getting a lot of heat from wifey. She just asked if Master Blaster is the guy she once threatened to castrate in a public forum after he invited me to party in Louisiana.

Remember her?

She's saying she'll follow through if you take up any more of our vacation time.

[MasterBlaster]

Just remember what it says in the Bible: You are the Head of the House. :drink:

[Tree Machine]

Just remember what it says in the Bible: You are the Head of the House.She's the neck. She has the capacity to decapitate the head.

[No_Bivy]

upload now bubba.......she aint watchin'

[brendonv]

Haha, that silky vid is a riot.

[Tree Machine]

Thanks, Brendon.

Before I started disclosing everything, we had an agreement regarding the future production of this reel. Anyone viewing it from YouTube is unaware of that agreement and if they go and produce and market it, I'd have to chase em down and have the lawyer send a letter. I would really rather any interest in this device come from here. When production commences, we'll use YouTube and any other marketing/exposure venue out there.

The agreement was that I encourage all of you to make one or two for yourselves, I gave you all the fine details. If you want to manufacture it and sell it, call me. With this arrangement we can get it to market at a reasonable cost to everybody. We all win.

As good as my lawyer is (he referred me to the intellectual property attorney) and the fact that we have had several discussions about this reel over the years (while demo'ing it on his giant oak), legal squabbles are just not the direction I care to go. For these reasons, I would prefer NOT to put this on You-Tube.

That reminds me, I still have a redirect sling up in his tree I forgot.

http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17598&stc=1&d=1200180679

[MasterBlaster]

Very true. YouTube is definitely in the public domain.

And be aware that this entire topic can be made even more private by posting it in the Tribal Elder's forum.

Jim, you could (I think) email it to me and I could upload it to my site then post it in the TE forum.

[No_Bivy]

bummer....how bout private viewing on the vid?

[Tree Machine]

I'm tellin ya, the video footage is boring. You'll see exactly what I've described in the last 10 pages

As far as private viewing, why? I want to share with all my Arbo brothers and sisters.

All right. Here's a video piece I did when I went from the large base, to the small base, but before I put the clear, flat base with the hole through it. This is also before the addition of the swivel. I wind it up using a stick, note my wrist is stiff. The current version is that much smoother, the wrist-on-a-ball-joint, and slightly faster. This version DID have Nick's nicks, which you'll see in use at the end.

Try this (http://treeguy.info/videos/shotline_reel.mov)

[MasterBlaster]

Yeah, sometimes that stuff doesn't translate very well.

[Tree Machine]

Meaning?

[MasterBlaster]

Like you said, the video footage is boring.

-edit- That sure did deploy well!

[Paul B]

that sure does reel in a heck of a lot faster than flaking into a rope bag!!
I am surprised it deploys off the reel, my gut feel was that it would take the reel up into the sky with the throwbay. neat stuff Tree machine.

[No_Bivy]

buy one where?

[Frans]

buy one where?

another person who doesn't read the entire thread......:roll:

[No_Bivy]

another person who doesn't read the entire thread......:roll:

:notworthy:

[Tree Machine]

What bivy is referring to is at the end of the video it says "Now go buy one". As we all know, they're not available, but at the time I made the video my intent was to make them available.

It still is. I just don't know how that will transpire.


The marketing, of course, would be through the forums and outward. That's the easy part, we sort of have a jump start on that. The carriage is clearly ahead of the horse.

I guess as long as we're talking about availability, how much would we be willing to pay for one? A 180' roll of Zing-It is $22 and that's what would go on it. I wouldn't be willing to put a lesser line on, unless you want a lesser performance, and that's silly. This is a time-saver, and anything in our industry that saves us time, makes us money, especially if you can put it in the hands of a groundguy and have him be able to use it successfully, right out of the box.

Call your price. We're creating it here and now. Don't be shy.

I'm digging up more video.

[Frans]

Thanks, Brendon.

Before I started disclosing everything, we had an agreement regarding the future production of this reel. Anyone viewing it from YouTube is unaware of that agreement and if they go and produce and market it, I'd have to chase em down and have the lawyer send a letter.

um, this IS a public forum by the way.......I personally will honor your request, just wanted to point this out.

[No_Bivy]

50 bucks....

[pantheraba]

First number I thought of was $85. If Zing-it is $22 and the reel is probably at least $10-$15...so you have almost $40 in parts. Then you have to make the modifications that TM has devised...guys gotta make some decent profit.

[Stumper]

If it goes into production the producer will presumably purchase Zing-it in bulk rather than pay full retail for individual spools. Of course thee are different marketing strategies-sell ready to go kits or sell the gizmo and let anyone load it themself with their tangle string of choice. My gut says that $65 will cause a lot less sticker shock than $80. $47 for one unloaded. Really these are just numbers that have little meaning until actual cost of producing it are determined. I know a fellow that produces a specialty product-one with considerable hand work added onto molded parts. RAW materials are only a couple of bucks but he has about 1.5 hours of labour in each $69 dollar product AND he spent 25,000 dollars to have the molds made and a run of his neoprene parts cast- It takes a lot of units to amortize a start up cost like that.

[Hobby Climber]

At the time of this post there are were about 2267 hits from people who have viewed this thread and only 170 replies.

With that much interest in TM`s novel product, someone or some company should be willing to take it to the next step. Though many tree guys are handy and innovative, many more would rather just buy whats already made for various reasons!

That said, as far as getting a company to crank out a truck load of them, they would have to be assured that they`ll get there money back from there startup investment. A lot of good inventions don't get produced because of the high cost to make that product. That and the fact that the tree care industry is a limited market. Thats just how big business works!

TM has developed a quality product for sure. Because no ONE tree guy can front that kind on money to get this thing into further development or production, the items progression goes no further.:cry: That sucks!

*


Modern arborculture is what it is today because those before us had the vision and were able to "Think Outside The Box" !

Many of us have thought of new ideas for products or a way to improve on old ideas. Some have also made, altered, added to, or otherwise modified our gear & equipment to make it perform better. Some ideas catch on where as others simply do not!


The problems in getting an invention or innovation off the ground generally boils down to:

1)- Where do we find someone who can produce our product/idea(s),

2)- Patton expenses & related issues,

3)- Marketing/sales/advertising/promotion,

4)- How can we safeguard ourselves from the company that makes our product (Design) from screwing us over and only looking out for their own interest, and

5)- What can we expect by way of compensation for our efforts?



How many times in the past has someone gone to a company or manufacturer, showed them there idea(s) & told that they were not interested? Then a year or so later, that same company is selling a very similar item to the one you had showed them earlier, (ie: retriever)! :what:

Even if you patten you invention, that does not stop someone else from producing and profiting from your idea. It just puts you in a better position if you decide to fight them in court. Oh, did I mention that court proceedings are very very $$$ expensive!!! :O Even if you have a very good case, a bigger company can easily bankrupt you in lengthy court proceedings! Just not worth in the long run in most cases!

I just wish there was some place that was well connected and could take TM`s (and others) idea(s) and bring them to that next level!!!




Later


HC

[Koa Man]

Mass production would be prohibitively expensive for an item like this, as good as it is, because the market is so small. For those that would like one but either don't have the time to hunt down parts and/or lack the skill to build one, maybe Jim would be willing to just hand build and sell them. I'm sure he could make one 10 times faster than someone who never made one before.

[No_Bivy]

If there is another Dunlap out there, I will sell that reel to you.

I bet I can scratch it off.....:D

[pantheraba]

I bet I can scratch it off.....:D

John, you are hilarious. Just don't sniff. :lol:

[Tree Machine]

Very interesting conversation.

Businesses sell their product at what they feel the market will bear. When has the market ever been consulted first and asked what they would like the price to be?

Normally, we are told what the price is, and the seller puts it out there and sees if the market will bear it, or not. Generally, they will go as high as they see possible. Lowering a price is generally easier than raising a price, that is if the higher price didn't offend everybody to begin with and turn the market away.

So, we are the market, preemptively talking about a product that does not yet exist and for which there is currently is no manufacturer or seller. I have to laugh thinking about that, but as unlikely a scenario as it is, that's where we're at. And making progress.

about 1.5 hours of labour in each $69 dollar product AND he spent 25,000 dollars to have the molds made and a run of his neoprene parts cast- It takes a lot of units to amortize a start up cost like that.

Thank you, Stumper. That kinda summs it up. We'll battle this with creativity.

My intuitive price thought was I would pay around $50 for a reel WITH line, and would want two because shotbags DO get hung up in trees. A second reel keeps the evil down-time to a minimum. If you don't lose them, or run over them with the truck, they should last years.

[Tree Machine]

maybe Jim would be willing to just hand build and sell them. I'm sure he could make one 10 times faster than someone who never made one before.
That would mean shipping them, too. Taking orders, putting them in boxes, address labels, managing the website, fielding phone calls..... The Tree Machine is not willing to, as said earlier, compromise his day job over this.

As far as making them, I will gladly offer assistance. I can bang one out in about 20 minutes, using just a jig saw, cordless drill and a propane torch. Add another minute to put the line on. It really IS easy to make them, but only if you have the raw reel to start with.

It wasn't easy to start with, as I had nothing to go on. Research and development, and field-testing took a lot of time, not quite as involved as dropping a VOLVO out of a tree, but those costs are behind us, the R and D phase is over and that has become my contribution to Arboriculture. Now, collectively, the rest is up to us.

Intuitively, I feel it would be just as easy, and a whole lot cheaper, to start with the electrical cord reel to begin with, rather than have some new plastics die made and commit all that time, energy and money. I mean, the setup for the electrical cord reel already exists (I presume). Farming this out to China, also not a cost-effective option because, as Koa says, mass producing to a tiny niche market does not work in this manner.

The effort to cut off the top and bottom plate only takes a couple minutes, and that is freehand, slow and careful on the top lip, and the bottom plate even easier, as the vertical drum itself is the guide fence for jigsaw. I hate the waste (I was seeking a no-waste version with the Koa model), but that plastic is probably recyclable.

After the first two cuts, there is contour sanding, fire-polishing, adhering the flat plate to the bottom with the industrial rubber sealant/adhesive, add the swivel. The line needs to be put on before the glue-up and installation of the bottom plate. Spinning the reel using a drill would allow the line to go on in seconds and also allow one to easily do the contour sanding on the upper lip with sandpaper on a block.

If proper jigs were set up to facilitate the procedure, I feel that one man in small 'U' shaped work station could do them, beginning to end in 10 minutes. I know this because I (one man)can make them without the 'U' shaped work station and without the jigs in 20. They could be boxed while the moisture-cure adhesive is setting up.

Maybe we could pitch this to The Discovery Channel on their "How Things are Made". The actual firing of the BigShot and rope-setting is interesting to see for just about anyone.

[No_Bivy]

Im hunting a reel today.........:/:

[Tree Machine]

Good on you, Bivy. I'm trying to find someone out there a trailer-truck load of them.

Hey, wait..... on one of the earlier pics I think I recall seeing the name of the reel manufacturer.

Hang on.....


going back.....


You just stay right there and give Tree Machine a minute.....

[Tree Machine]

There it is, page 11, post #106
Right here (http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17529&stc=1&d=1199956157)


Here's a closeup of the name,

[Tree Machine]

Closer up.....

[Tree Machine]

Levitron???

Let's try that as a website, http://levitron.com



Uhhhh, cool, but not the right place.


I'm counting 7 letters, lets try http://leviton.com

Hmmm, I think we got it.

It seems to be a huge site. I couldn't come up with anything using the 'search' line. Maybe one of you can have better luck searching down the extension cord reel. Interestingly I found the Leviton motion detector I have at home that trips the hidden Xenon strobe light and air compressor, the front line of my 'theft deterrent system' surrounding the tree truck. Any thief who chooses to continue past this is in for a real 'shock'. The police have warned me that booby trapping is illegal. I told them, "So is trespassing and theft. I'll take my chances."

It's Sunday right now, I'll put in a call to Leviton tomorrow, during business hours. I've gotta go be on vacation with Girlie Girl for now.

[Frans]

I think the Levitron would make an excellent line setter!

[MasterBlaster]

double-u tea eff???

[Hobby Climber]

That things out of this world.

BTW, ...Phone home!:lol:

:greetings: :greetings: :greetings: :greetings: :greetings:

HC

[No_Bivy]

I could only find the yellow "woods" model. and of course a million orange ones. What the best way to cut it down?

[Tree Machine]

I use a Bosch jig saw, medium blade, start on slow speed, increase speed a bit if you feel the need. Too much speed combined with too slow a feed rate will cut and melt. You just want to cut.

You can leave the base as is, you can always change it later.

Sand the upper rim lip so it has a round contour. Use a block with sandpaper, 60 grit, then fire polish with a propane torch, also on low-med. Use a light touch. Don't over do it, you can screw it up at this stage. You should watch the sanding marks go from little lines to completly smooth. I love that part.

Drill a small hole for the line, right up next to the drum, all the way through the bottom plate. Feed the shotline through the hole. You terminate it on the bottom side, big knot or a little anchor or cow hitch around a toothpick.

Wind from the drum, one revolution at a time, stopping every few revs to push the winds tightly together (no space between them). This first winding, all the way across needs to be taut and packed tightly, from drum base to the lip. The remaining length of the 180 feet, wind with moderate tension (thigh clamp) so that when it's all said and done there's more bulk nearer the drum side than the outer side.

I haven't seen the yellow reel in years, It was a really good reel, as good or better than the black Leviton. I only had two of those. Wish I had a pic of the truck tire parked on top of it.

Take some pics for us during the build, OK? Keep track of how long it takes. I predict under a half hour. Thanks for stepping up to be first, Bivy.

[No_Bivy]

I found it at a hole in the wall hardare store..12 bucks. Everywhere else was the orange ones. I 'll begin the project tommorrow........ok maybe tommorrow night, gotta work early:D

[Tree Machine]

Here's the Woods elecrtrical site, woods.com (http://woods.com)

I went and saw their online catalog and found the yellow reel.
Apparently it is still in production, item 2870 below.

I'll be giving Leviton and Woods a call tomorrow.
http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17636&stc=1&d=1200278792

[Tree Machine]

Here's something interesting, world headquarters, all of 10 km from my house, http://gypoclimber.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17638&stc=1&d=1200282269

[Frans]

I went to the local hardware store, and then to Home Depot. No luck. The ones they had were the orange ones with the handle that follows the inner curve of the drum. Very cheap and flimsy model.

I will look some more when I have time...

[Ax-Man]

I went to the local hardware store, and then to Home Depot. No luck. The ones they had were the orange ones with the handle that follows the inner curve of the drum. Very cheap and flimsy model.

I will look some more when I have time...

That is the same thing I found at three different stores, cheap flimsy orange ones. I wouldn't even buy them for an extension cord reel let alone as a potential shotline winder. That sounds so sophisticated doesn't it.

[Koa Man]

The lastest Arbor Age magazine I just got had an article about different ways to store the throwball and line. Nothing like what we have here...only bags, buckets and F cubes.

[No_Bivy]

moded reel today....loaded 300'.....test in the morning.

[No_Bivy]

12 dolla'...........Demo later......

[NickfromWI]

Why not just throw 200' on each one? That way you can buy the Zing-it in a way that samson already makes them.

What a fun phone call. "Hi, I'd like 4 miles of throwline. How much would that cost?"

Let us know how it goes!

love
nick

[Burnham]

Why not just throw 200' on each one? That way you can buy the Zing-it in a way that samson already makes them.

What a fun phone call. "Hi, I'd like 4 miles of throwline. How much would that cost?"

Let us know how it goes!

love
nick

Yeah, where I work, 180 feet isn't near enough...200 isn't either, for many jobs. I'd be loading 300 feet like No Bivy.

That doesn't divide into 1,000 ft evenly either :cry: .
:)

[Frans]

You know I like your idea but unfortunately the spool does not seem to be available readily.
I even searched on-line to no avail.

So unless the reel becomes easily available, the invention is a no go.

[No_Bivy]

The only reason I loaded 300...is cause I had it. All though, sometimes a launch that isn't isolated eats up a throw line length.
A case of 8 is how much?..........

[No_Bivy]

dude...read some of the other threads..................485. thats cheap////:D

[MasterBlaster]

Where are all the images Master Blaster?


Pay attention! (http://www.gypoclimber.com/showthread.php?t=9473) :what:

[Koa Man]

At least the avatars are still intact.:lol:

[pantheraba]

At least the avatars are still intact.:lol:

Yeahhhhhh....ain't life good. :D

[Frans]

The reels from Woods are $4.85 each.


Will you supply us with more comprehensive information on how to get this 'woods' reel?



Where are all the images Master Blaster?

Dont get your knickers in a knot, we have all lost in this 'corrupt database' error :)

[Frans]

thanks. I had checked the thread but forgot the pix were missing, Duh

[Koa Man]

I don't see an edit button on the posts either. If there was an edit button I could repost the pictures I put on.

[brendonv]

I think he changed the edit function to only 10 minutes. Why I don't know?

[MasterBlaster]

I can always change it back, but not now cuz I lost a lotta admin functions.

[squisher]

I think if you look around guys you'll see that Butch is trying to learn what he can do to solve these problems. It's not something that he wants either, I'm sure he didn't change those settings like that on purpose. As I understand it he's going to be paying a tech to help sort some of these issues. Shoot we have all enjoyed this forum for free if we choose to, and for a contribution if we've chosen to donate. Butch has footed the bill and kept things running on his own.

This is a huge setback no doubt but let's give Butch the benefit of the doubt here he created the House and I'm sure will do everything he can to keep it running properly.

I say it's times like these were we need to step up and say yah this sucks how can we help fix it.

[MasterBlaster]

Thank you.

[Koa Man]

I appreciate this forum too and that's why I help support it by making a donation every January. If everyone would donate even a small amount like $35 yearly [more if you can afford it], that is less than 10 cents a day to hang out with the greatest bunch of tree guys in the world.

[pantheraba]

Hey, TM...I suspect something got crossed up with the donation "thank you"...when I have donated, he has been prompt to say "Thanks" with a personal PM.

I share your angst and frustration at losing all that pictorial info. Once in awhile, I will snag a pict and put it in my archives, but mostly I just figured I could do a search someday for whatever picts I needed and they would be there.

Your comment about fixing a database problem by deleting some of the info is well made. It may be that was the only way to save some of the info but it sure is a loss.

It sounds like there are several ideas percolating about how to recover from the mishap...we'll have to see what the Boss comes up with.

I'm fixing to make my donation soon...gotta figure out how PayPal works again...I almost never use it and have to get my password again.

[pantheraba]

I'm fixing to make my donation soon...gotta figure out how PayPal works again...I almost never use it and have to get my password again.

Good news...MB made it easy. When I went to the "PayPal donate button" the option to use VISA (or other cards) came up, too.

I donated with VISA...one day I'll try to figure out my PayPal account again.

Thanks, MB, for your constant attention. Keep us posted as to how we can help.

[MasterBlaster]

Thanks Gary. You can fix your PayPal problems by reregistering using another email address.

And Jim I don't know what to say other than I'm not perfect. And I'm not the one who opted to delete the database, that was Funkys doing. And I'm sorry if I didn't thank you for your donation. I greatly appreciate the support ya'll give the TH thru donations and sponsors are my favorite people in the world. So I know it's late but "Thanks for your donation, Jim!" :beer:

[Frans]

Jim, I think you need to get a grip. On the one hand you say you have contibuted to the TreeHouse, but in the next sentence you say you didn't get 'thanked'.

Whats up with that? :?

contributed contribute |kənˈtribyoōt; -byət|
verb [ trans. ]
give (something, esp. money) in order to help achieve or provide something : he contributed more than $500,000 to the center | [ intrans. ] she contributed to a private pension.
• [ intrans. ] ( contribute to) help to cause or bring about : gases that contribute to global warming.
• supply (an article) for publication : he contributed articles to the magazine | [ intrans. ] the staff who contribute to your sports pages are doing a splendid job.
• [ intrans. ] give one's views in a discussion : he did not contribute to the meetings.

I really feel that you are assuming an attitude which is unwarranted.

I suggest you take a moment and reflect on what it must take to host a web forum.
Picture yourself doing this and ask yourself: Can I do a better job? Be honest!

[Paul B]

I threw a few bucks in yesterday, there was a polite thanks in my PM box within 24 hours.

It sucks mightily that the pics got deleted but if that was the way to continue then there really isnt much to gain complaining about it. I lost ALL my pics from april to august of 07 due to a drive failure, a lot of them that I liked I had posted up, my bad twice over for being lazy and not retrieving them before the database failure. :(

guess I gotta go make new memories! 8)

[MasterBlaster]

And back up yo shit!

[No_Bivy]

footplates...anyone..anyone...........:D

[top hopper]

$1.00

[pantheraba]

$1.00

Haha...we may have lost our pictures but not our sense of humor. :lol:

Orrrr....maybe you were serious? :O

[top hopper]

ok ok ok

$2.00 for the both of em

[MasterBlaster]

you have people hired to keep things running and tidy. My problem is the dude who, by his own words, projects outwardly that he kicked some ass and fixed the problem. he just deleted the entire database and calls it good.

I have no "people hired." Funky and Doc (Funky is a pseudowebmaster) are my friends and they do all the work on this site for free. Funky is a super busy mofo and I'm glad he takes the time to look at these forum problems when they arise.
This problem is beyond Funky's level of expertise, so I'm paying for some phone tech support. I won't have access to them until later in the week, and I sure hope that solves the problem. Additionally, I found out that I was running an expired out of date version of this forum, so I renewed the license for another year.
And from what Funky told me, HE didn't delete the database - it was screwed already. That was why we couldn't post attachments. He merely restored it to make it work again. I hope to find out from the tech why that crap happened in the first place.

Sorry for any inconvenience.

[pantheraba]

Well stated, TM....I concur. :thumbup:

[No_Bivy]

........nothing can stop the treehouse

[Tom Dunlap]

Both gifts he sent back with a thank you note and that he had his own way of doing things. That is true, no doubt. I could tell by the way I had reeled it up, it had not even been used.


The reel is a very clever solution for storing throwline. After using it several times for short and long shots I decided that it didn't work into my scheme. Instead of having the reel sit on my shelf unused I sent it back so that it could stay in circulation.

Using two cubes, the first one is one of the original 80 some prototypes that were used to perfect the design and the other is a Sherrill version, I prefer to use them. They deploy the line fine and I can store more throwline in less volume.

Keep up the creative solutions!

[Frans]

We could close this thread now.

why not re-post your pix?

[MasterBlaster]

:thumbup:

[MasterBlaster]

No edit function?

No shit?

[Frans]

Ask my wife why I don't just re-post them. That should bring an interesting response.


Are you serious? :O
Why on god's green earth would you want to bring her into the discussion?


I understand your frustration, and I personally feel empathy for you, but I DONT understand the kind of bad attitude you present about the whole thing.

[Koa Man]

Yeah, where is the edit button???

[MasterBlaster]

Ya'll don't have an edit button? :what:

And Frans, I'm assuming Jim means his wife doesn't want him to spend more time frigging around on the computer.

[MasterBlaster]

The edit function been working for a couple of weeks now.

And your woman needs to check out a real porn site before she defames the TreeHouse.

:X

[Hobby Climber]

Hi Jim,

I'm sure everyone here got something out of all your hard work & efforts regarding you cool invention!!! As you know, how things are said or how they are understood by others is kinda difficult to match up over the computer at times.

Peoples perspective on things is also different than other peoples. A simple comment may bring up an old issue that may flame another without the person who first commented ever knowing, & things like that.

(Without getting into details...mentioning the word "PORN" on this site happens to be one such an example)!

Although the timing simply down right sucked during you intense information flowing marathon (which we are greatful), shit happens and we just have to deal with it for lack of a better solution after the fact!

As you well know, the more information that flows on the "TREE" sites (Tree House), the better our industry is for it!!! You bring a heck of a lot to the table with you years of knowledge and time saving ideas and IMHO this site is the better for it!

The majority on this site are only interested in the good information that a thread contains, anything else just derails it.

I for one would love to see a video clip of your invention in action an I'm sure others would as well. This gadget of yours is worthy of further discussion and should be continued.

This recent computer glitch is now an "old issue" and I don't think much else can be done about it.

*

Moving forward...

A question I'd like to ask is this:

Q- Have you ever carried it up a tree and do you think a mini version could be fashioned for work while in the canopy.

Q- There are a lot of good ideas for a better system beginning to emerge from this thread & Id like to see what happens next!


So how about that video clip!

Back to you,



Bob (Hobby Climber)

[MasterBlaster]

Uhhhh...

Okay then.

[Skwerl]

Nobody's telling you what to do, Jim, but we do have an unofficial 'No Whining' rule around here. You're welcome to post or not post and nobody will mind either way. But the unproductive complaining has got to stop.

[Frans]

Is that what the majority wants?

Do you need it spelled out?

O.K...

We have all said (after the crash) repeatedly, that we enjoyed and are interested in your invention. AND we said your thread would be worthy of resurrection.

I stand by that.



Now, I still don't understand your attitude.




If you took the time to read the posts regarding your invention AFTER THE CRASH, you could plainly see that your initial query was MORE than answered.....

So what is the hold-up?

[Hobby Climber]

...So ...moving "forward" for the benefit of everyone, (since we CAN'T undo whats been done!!!)...


Jim, how about RE-kicking this thread off with a pic of the finished product and the a video clip of it in action!!! I think it will be easy enough for everyone who had been following the thread to pick it up from that point. (Make the best out of a bad situation). That should do the trick given the circumstances.;) HINT!



So again I ask you... How about that video clip of it in action???

Please!!!

HC



ps- Ah don't mind Frans, he ate a big block of cheese the other day and is a little cranky.:P (just kidding).

[Koa Man]

The edit function been working for a couple of weeks now.



The edit button disappears after a day or so. What I meant when I asked where is the edit button is for the older posts, like at the very beginning of this thread. If there was an edit button I could repost the pictures. No big deal, really, I'll just post the original pictures here.

This is the one TM gave me and it works just fine the way it is. I did add some slots to hook the line to, as was suggested earlier in this thread [Nick's nicks].

[xtremetrees]

TM keep it up bro. THis could benefit many and could even be the shotline package of the future I think!

[Frans]

My advice? Just go on from here and post your stuff.

Missing/deleted posts is what started the problem in the first place.

...Tomorrow is another day.
--Vivien Leigh in 'Gone with the wind'