how to cable

[sotc]

did a cabling job yesterday:/:

[sotc]

efficient use of a cable

[squisher]

Ummm :what: , you're messing with me aren't ya?

I know that wasn't you doing that Willie, what are you doing fixing it?

[Mr. Sir]

:bs:

[brendonv]

nice work...:O ....looks like you replaced it above with Cobra, is that what I see hanging? :D

[sotc]

busted:D thats a mess huh? they had a lead split last febuary and another local company did a "quarter round" pruning on it and installed this "system" below the halfway mark. the owner had 1 bolt break already and knew it didnt look right. we just came and installed a cobra with out the shock absorber and a 3/4" bolt through the split. the rest of it i left alone as the old guy would go broke trying to support every bad union in a modesto ash. specially after paying for the job once already

[top hopper]

I cant believe they used lag hooks.

[MasterBlaster]

Where are the thimbles?


I cant believe they used lag hooks.

No shit, lordy!

[Tom_Scheller]

I cant believe they used lag hooks.

I thought lags were OK as long as the wood is solid and they're in line with the pull. ...which in those pics they are not.

TS

[top hopper]

I forget what the standards say, but I only use lags on smallish limbs. If its over 12" diameter I would recommend thru bolts. Not to mention lags are a pin to put in, Id rather drill all the way thru and push the hardware in instead of threading it in.

I also like how they put several cables on each termination.

[squisher]

It's comparable to some of our local work done on city property even, I'll try and remember to grab a pic or two one of these days of the rats nest down by the library.

[sotc]

in the second to last picture they wrapped the tail coming from 1 bolt 10 or so times around itself so they could redirect off to another tail and clamped them together! also one of the lags was the male part of a gate hinge :roll:

[IchWarriorMkII]

Forgive my ignorant question, but whats the idea of the cabeling system?

I have an idea how they work... but nothing based on facts, just my own speculation.

[Old Monkey]

There are two main kinds of cabling, stiff metal cables and springy elastic cables. The metal cables give extra support for weak unions but do not allow the tree to flex in the wind. Newer cabling systems are more elastic and give support while allowing for motion.

[treelooker]

The metal cables give extra support for weak unions but do not allow the tree to flex in the wind. They do if you leave a little slack.;)

[MasterBlaster]

And slack is exactly what you're supposed to leave.

[inztrees]

We can not use cobra Its Ibolts preformed wraps and EHS cable. I think cobra looks like a big snake.

[sotc]

why not? i use both depending on the tree and situation

[Skwerl]

Cable with the preformed wraps is all I've ever used. Nice and clean installation when using the proper gear. :thumbup:

[inztrees]

the lab said no and if we have to we need to call then first

[sotc]

who do you work for?

[inztrees]

Bartlett

[sotc]

what kind of lab do they have?

[inztrees]

are you kidding its like 200 acres in nc they test lightning systens ,cables ,firt ,sprays and other classified stuf (tree geeks) who do you work for and wheres your lab?hummmm?

[Skwerl]

Neat! I wasn't aware that Bartlett had that kind of facility. I thought they were just another line clearance company.

[inztrees]

dont even do that any more sold that to Asplundh

[Bodean]

Yeah Bartlett was super techy for awhile.

Hey SOTC, did you land the job to pull all that crap and use some better hardware?

[sotc]

that is kinda cool, i work for myself heres my lab :) http://gypoclimber.com/showthread.php?t=9197&page=6&highlight=foam+core

no i didnt pull all that stuff deva, just added a cobra up higher and a bolt though a split.

[inztrees]

so you tye it into a bolt not around tree?

[Stumper]

They do if you leave a little slack.;)

The ginormous problem with leaving slack in a static system is twofold.
1 If the Tree is being given a static cabling because it already has sustained damage.... slack is a no-no.
2. If the tree simply needs some supplemental support for protection from extreme events... Ice loads will load up slowly, tighten the slack and it can work BUT wind events may SLAM the cables taut and break things.

Dynamic cables are perfect for dynamic events. Static cabling has a place but generally it sucks. The cases where static is the best choice it should generally be taut. If movement is okay then dynamic is the better choice.

[sotc]

my ehs cables go into bolts but the cobra is spliced like this

[top hopper]

I no longer like cobra.....

Ive reinspected several of my previous installs and they had begun to girdle. I am now worried about everyone Ive installed..... ( hundreds)

the supposed splicing is supposed to grow with the tree when properly installed. I'm certain I buried the proper length and installed them with plenty of slack and still yet they don't expand and had begun to girdle. I think guardian is a better option, its a fixed eye splice, but you create the splice 1 1/2 to 2 times the limb diameter instead of cinching tightly and relying on a self adjusting girth increasing splice.
I plan to pull my records and gradually replace all installed cobras with guardian systems. The trick will be incorporating it with the repeat of ongoing work to minimize losses due to additional labor. Fortunately, most of the cables Ive installed were on mature trees so growth rates wont be tremendous. I figure starting with the oldest first, Ive got 1-3 years to get them replaced. I might create some sort of spread sheet in which install date and specie (due to varying growth rates) will set the priority and help determine best order in which to start.

Bring it Tobe!

[MasterBlaster]

I haven't installed one yet.

I knew my gut was right. :drink:

[sotc]

ill keep an eye for that thanks. i guess manually loosen them on annual inspections to

[Tom_Scheller]

Ive reinspected several of my previous installs and they had begun to girdle. I am now worried about everyone Ive installed..... ( hundreds)


I was saw a presentation at Penn State where they said the same thing. They had quite a few photos of it. In fact, they found not just Cobra, but anything that wraps around eventually starts to girdle. Their research was based, in part, on the magnificent collection of American Elms on their property.

They still use those systems to support overextended horizontal limbs, but everything else is EHS.

TS

[Mike Maas]

The only way I could see them girdle is if they are under continuous load. Are you installing them too tight?
If there isn't a load, why wouldn't it just slide open? Nick, you have an opinion why a loose hollow braid like Cobra wouldn't slide without a load?

[treelooker]

1 If the Tree is being given a static cabling because it already has sustained damage.... slack is a no-no.Uh yeah I think i mentioned if it's got a crack, then no slack (not in those words but...)

2. If the tree simply needs some supplemental support for protection from extreme events... Ice loads will load up slowly, tighten the slack and it can work BUT wind events may SLAM the cables taut and break things.This is a big problem if the cable is too low, but what if it;'s 2/3 or + ?

[TC3]

I can only go by the Cobra systems installed since 2001. There's only a half dozen jobs I check on, but all are holding up well.
I'll provide pix if you'd like ?

[sotc]

that would be cool, please

[inztrees]

I no longer like cobra.....

Ive reinspected several of my previous installs and they had begun to girdle. I am now worried about everyone Ive installed..... ( hundreds)

the supposed splicing is supposed to grow with the tree when properly installed. I'm certain I buried the proper length and installed them with plenty of slack and still yet they don't expand and had begun to girdle. I think guardian is a better option, its a fixed eye splice, but you create the splice 1 1/2 to 2 times the limb diameter instead of cinching tightly and relying on a self adjusting girth increasing splice.


This is why the lab says NO